Feel deprived because of the way their parents brought them
up when they get out in the world on their own?

I mean some day they are going to be living with partners who may not want to Dumpster Dive or wash baggies.
Do you think this could affect them in a negative way?

Today's world is alot different than when she wanted this pre 1900 house with attached barn... Just curious...

I really don't think they did. They had just about everything anyone else did. They just didn't pay full price like everyone else. JMO.

No never. Amy's kids had one thing every parent should give their kids and thats love and encouragement. That was very evident throughout all her books. She also always said once the kids were older that things would probably change.

Why because they were frugal, would they feel deprived. We give our kids far too many things in today's society and they don't appreciate what they get. Give a child a box, some pots and pans and they are quite happy. Why do kids need everything that comes on the market today?

Why would washing out baggies or dumpster diving affect kids unless we made an issue of being so poor we had too. I never read that in Amy's books. They had goals they worked for and accomplished them by being frugal.

Why is today's world any different than when Amy wrote her books several years ago. I don't see that at all.

The economy is different than the 60's to me.
Minimum wage ( yes I'm sure her kids all went to college )
Heating, insurance, cost of living.
Health insurance is skyrocketing.
I guess my point is that the world will be completely different
for them if they find partners that don't share this frugal zealot
mentality that Amy has.
I try to teach my DS to be frugal, but I know he feels let down because he doesn't have stuff the other kids have.
He has all the love I can give him and he had the box and pots and pans.
He has some now that he's older ( no ATVS, no snowmobiles etc )
I just think she took it to far where the kids were concerned.JMHO

I have mixed ideas about this. One of few issues I really differed on with her was the "need" for braces on kids teeth. She thought/thinks it is for cosmetics only and in my view not only do you get nice looking teeth, but your whole mouth (and BODY!) is healthier in the end. If her kids had crooked teeth do you suppose they got braces? I'm guessing not -- or they will do it for themselves when they are adults and gone from home.

Now whether they might end up with partners who are not frugal, I'm guessing that because of the way they were raised that their deepest sense of self won't have anything in common with someone who was raised spending money at every turn.

Certainly they have been given tons and tons of love and support from their parents... and that is most definitely the main important issue. It would be extremely interesting to hear about the kids' outlook sometime in the future.

I don't know about all the things she did/didn't do, but one of the things that I always remember about that book is that she said she'd only read them 1 book per day. That bothered me...it was like she was too busy being frugal to spend time with them.

That bothered me also Michelle.
I always looked forward to reading to Kenny . We read at bedtime and during the day if he wanted. Dishes could wait, laundry could wait to be folded, grass could wait to be mowed.
My family came first even if I had to stay up half the night to catch up.
Why have the kids if your not going to enjoy them to the fullest?
The other stuff was unimportant compared to him.
You can type in the middle of the night when they were sleeping. You can iron clothes or wash dishes when they were asleep.
JMHO

I think the children would be affected to an extent but it may not be a negative impact. I do think they will have a difficult time if their life partner is not as frugal as they are. But they might just be ready to splurge. Who knows. I think each of us has to make decisions as to what works in our lives and our families when it comes to frugality and simply living. My children never had all the bells and whistles since I could not afford them but they always had love and attention. And a big extended family to have fun with. Maybe Amy's children will write a book someday.....hummm...wonder if Amy would buy it??? LOL

I think you'd have to get the kid's point of view on this one. I think a lot has to do with whatever peer pressure the kids encountered along the way that would have made them feel deprived or not. (I know my DS feels deprived because he doesn't have his own cell phone - everyone else does in our neighborhood!)
I know that I've practiced thrift ever since I was married, but my kids are turning out different.
I just try to look at the upside that if my kids ever do need to revert to a thrifty lifestyle in the future, they've been taught how to do it! ;)

Originally posted by grace1902
I think you'd have to get the kid's point of view on this one. I think a lot has to do with whatever peer pressure the kids encountered along the way that would have made them feel deprived or not. (I know my DS feels deprived because he doesn't have his own cell phone - everyone else does in our neighborhood!)


Yeah! I mean, Amy lived in a small town in Maine - so probably most of the kids that her children went to school with didn't have the latest toys or the most expensive branded clothes, and I think that this goes a long way in determining how "deprived" you feel. I went to a different high school from my elementary system, and I could feel it - in middle school it was ok to wear jeans from Walmart because everyone else did, but in my high school parents would give their kids cars for their 16th birthday! I know that I felt my family was a lot "poorer" when I was in high school compared to elementary school. Since Amy picked a large house in rural Maine, I'm guessing that the peer pressure was considerably less.


The other factor that I always wondered was seeing exactly how frugal their mom was. I can remember reading an article somewhere on how either you can control your money, or your money can control you. This is also true even when you're not in debt - if you spend every minute of your life trying to save money, then money still has control over your life. If I saw my mom buying soy flour because it was cheaper than eggs - then I would definetly see her as being controlled by her money, which is not the best example I'd want to set. Not that I don't want my future kids to be frugal, but I don't want them to think about the cost savings every 5 seconds (can I have a glass of juice, or should it be water? Should I open the refidgerator door now, or wait until 5pm when the electric rates go down? Can I go put gas in my car today, or do I have to wait until $.05 off Sunday? Can I flush the toilet or will that jack up water bill Etc.). I want to teach my kids to follow their dreams - and frugality is a tool I use to reach my dreams - but that they don't need to be constantly ruled by money.

I do remember Amy WAS in favor of braces for kids if needed. Even her own daughter. She (Amy) knew the pain of growing up and living with a less than perfect smile.

Some things I do feel she was a little extreme about, like making a child finish every last pea (or whatever) on their plate. I would never do that. The one book rule at bedtime, too. Sometimes I have been known to spend an hour or two reading to my daughter. She is nine years old now, and a very advanced reader herself, and I still read to her every night. We both love sharing the stories.

As a mother of 5....and with very vivid memories of my OWN childhood/early adulthood....I am betting that her kids did feel "different" somehow. How they interpreted it or how it affected them as adults, I don't know--but JMHO there is NO WAY that they didn't notice what was going on and that it was different than the way their friends lived. Some of Amy's ideas I loved, others I didn't care for BUT I do know that if we tried to live the exact same way, my middle-school age sons would be embarrassed. Kids that age, and high-school age, are sensitive to being "very different" than everyone else.

I do try to be as frugal as I possibly can, as we don't have tons of $$$ but I would not send my older kids to school in clothes that I had boxed up for them 10 years ago, and some of Amy's lunchbox ideas would totally be tossed in the trash by most older kids...where is the savings in that?

My opinion only, of course.

It would be cool to read an interview with the kids now. I think it would be easier to be "hard-core" frugal if they had homeschooled. Much less peer pressure.

I remember when she wrote about making one of her sons do extra chores to earn the 25¢ just because he wanted a small bag of Fritos in his lunch box ONE TIME. That struck me as kind of odd. Like she was trying to make the whole thing so distasteful that he would never want Fritos again. In fact she added that he didn't think Fritos were "worth it". Strange.

Originally posted by Telephus44

The other factor that I always wondered was seeing exactly how frugal their mom was. I can remember reading an article somewhere on how either you can control your money, or your money can control you. This is also true even when you're not in debt - if you spend every minute of your life trying to save money, then money still has control over your life. If I saw my mom buying soy flour because it was cheaper than eggs - then I would definetly see her as being controlled by her money, which is not the best example I'd want to set. Not that I don't want my future kids to be frugal, but I don't want them to think about the cost savings every 5 seconds (can I have a glass of juice, or should it be water? Should I open the refidgerator door now, or wait until 5pm when the electric rates go down? Can I go put gas in my car today, or do I have to wait until $.05 off Sunday? Can I flush the toilet or will that jack up water bill Etc.). I want to teach my kids to follow their dreams - and frugality is a tool I use to reach my dreams - but that they don't need to be constantly ruled by money.

I find this to be very interesting, because I see it the total opposite way. I find this to be controlling your money. If I choose to buy 4 bags of Malt-o-Meal Marshmallow Mateys at .84 a bag instead of one box of Lucky Charms at $3.89, I think that I am controlling my money, not the other way around. It is me ensuring that I have the money to spend on other things for my family. My kids are dressed, almost completely (with the exception of a few Christmas gifts from grandpa), in hand-me-down clothing from relatives and friends. Again, rather than spend hundreds of dollars on clothing for the kids, I'm making the choice to spend that money elsewhere that may bring us more joy than clothes, like a week at the beach. If I spent that money on clothes or name brand food, then we wouldn't be able to afford a vacation and the money would be controlling where and what we were able to do. My choice, my power, my control.

Teaching my kids not to be wasteful with money, I believe, is an important tool for them as they get older. If they learn to ignore the peer pressure of having all the material things in the world, then perhaps that will transfer over and help them to ignore the peer pressure of drugs, alcohol and sex as well. Maybe not, but it's definitely a step in the right direction.

And, when I look back at the kids I went to school with and when I look at the kids I teach in 8th grade now, it's really not the kids who have everything that are the happiest. It's the kids who have a strong sense of themselves that isn't tied into what the other kids think of them that are the happiest. That's what I want for my kids.

Originally posted by i.m.cheap
I do remember Amy WAS in favor of braces for kids if needed. Even her own daughter. She (Amy) knew the pain of growing up and living with a less than perfect smile.



This is interesting -- because I definitely remember being outraged by her remarks that braces were for cosmetics only. Her viewpoint that they would have been nice for herself and her daughter must have been in one of her books or an interview that I do not have. I am certain read her negative comments in an issue of the newsletter.

Some things I do feel she was a little extreme about, like making a child finish every last pea (or whatever) on their plate. I would never do that. The one book rule at bedtime, too.

No, that's silly to do. And neither one of them have to do with frugality.

If you force someone to eat beyond their capacity, you're wasting food *inside* them instead of *outside* them. Overeating is as wasteful as throwing it away.

Books are free at the library and being well read will increase your earning power as well as your quality of life.

So, imho, those things are about being a bit of a control freak and not about frugality.

babs

Ok, I 'm not Amy's child. But I was brought up very frugal.
I think I inherited my frugal ways from my mother.
I remember not having everything the other kids had.....
I also remember getting a few "new" things they really meant a lot to me. ( A pair of purple Kangaroo tennis shoes!! Gosh they were ugly!!)
I think that the things "I done without" gave me personality.
I wouldn't change anything in my childhood! It made me, ME!

Originally posted by Hollyhandi
The economy is different than the 60's to me.
Minimum wage ( yes I'm sure her kids all went to college )


I don't believe this was the 60's. Her books came out in the 90's and her twins weren't very old then.

AmyBoz I totally agree with your post.

Bridge - you said "I think that the things "I done without" gave me personality. I would change anything in my childhood. It made me, ME" What an awesome statement!!!

I still have to say although some of Amy's ideas were extreme, they realized their goals together as a family. I know that many would call some of my ideas extreme. However we've reached our goals too.

You know my girls all gripe about not everything that everyone else does. BUT they also have a mom who stays home and is here to tend to their every need, something NONE of their friends have.

I think that teaching the girls that saving and being frugal is much better than teaching them to spend money on things they don't need and will put them into debt. IMO people who give their kids everything are only giving them the idea that they don't have to work for the things they need and want. I LIKE the fact that being frugal shows my girls how to budget, spend wisely and put family first. I don't think Amy's kids will feel deprived, and I know mine won't.

Originally posted by mommy2many
You know my girls all gripe about not everything that everyone else does. BUT they also have a mom who stays home and is here to tend to their every need, something NONE of their friends have.

I think that teaching the girls that saving and being frugal is much better than teaching them to spend money on things they don't need and will put them into debt. IMO people who give their kids everything are only giving them the idea that they don't have to work for the things they need and want. I LIKE the fact that being frugal shows my girls how to budget, spend wisely and put family first. I don't think Amy's kids will feel deprived, and I know mine won't.

Amen!!

It had to be at least early 80's then because my mom was still alive and she passed away in 1985.
I think there had to be some negative feedback if only in her childrens thoughts. JMHO
I'm not arguing with anyone I am just curious as to what other think.
I try to be very frugal and I know it affects my DS in some aspects.

Originally posted by mommy2many
You know my girls all gripe about not everything that everyone else does. BUT they also have a mom who stays home and is here to tend to their every need, something NONE of their friends have.

I think that teaching the girls that saving and being frugal is much better than teaching them to spend money on things they don't need and will put them into debt. IMO people who give their kids everything are only giving them the idea that they don't have to work for the things they need and want. I LIKE the fact that being frugal shows my girls how to budget, spend wisely and put family first. I don't think Amy's kids will feel deprived, and I know mine won't.

Well said. :clap:

I really like Amy's book. I'm not as frugal as I want to be all the time, but her book has helped me trim some of the excess from our lives.

For instance, reading about the dumpster diving (EEEWWW!!!) made me really look at the way I was handling food and other disposable items. Now I throw away maybe one food item a week, garbage is down to two kitchen size bags a week and I rarely eat lunch or dinner out anymore. She made me realize that I was living such a throw away lifestyle that there would be nothing to leave my children with. If for nothing else I commend her for that. Even if all her children rebel, hopefully some part of that will stay with them.

JMHO

My parents weren't frugal but I had to finish every last pea also.
This was the canned kind too. :ack:

I think what is important here is that Amy and her husband are living thier lives the way they want to. When the children are grown and gone, they can choose to live thier life the way they see fit to.

I think it's funny that we can become so concerned over whether our children like us and like how they're being raised. I think Amy's approach to her children is an old-fashioned one for nowadays---she's not their friend, she's their parent. My parents were very strict with throwing things away, recycling, making sure we chipped in our own money when we wanted something extra. They weren't my best friend by any means.

But now, as an adult, I actually call to talk to them about everything and ask their opinion and feedback. I have the greatest respect for them because they insisted on doing things for my own good---and surprise!! I really think that I am a better person now because I finished all of my funky tabbouleh that my dad always made :D

I agree that being frugal teaches girls (and hopefully boys) how to budget and manage house. This is becoming a lost art; and if you don't believe me, see how many young couples can't manage their checkbook or cook a homemade meal. :rolleyes:

Sorry, I had to add that eating the tabbouleh paid off because I married a man whose greatest desire is to live in the Middle East and who loves all things Arab. We eat things far crazier than tabbouleh now---my father's lesson now promotes marital harmony! Who knew?!!

I really enjoy reading the TG. It's entertaining and useful. I pick out the parts that make sense to me and don't bother with the parts that I feel don't apply to me. I was raised by a very frugal mom and a spendthrift dad. I never felt poor because we always had everything we needed plus extra. Now raising my own kids, I am aware of the affluence of the area we live in. We are not poor by any means, but we are not wasteful, either. My kids see a skewed vision of what life is, because of the excesses that most of the people have around here. I try to explain to them that this town is not "normal", but I'm not sure they really understand the point I am trying to make.
I do want them to have lives free of debt and not feel they are slaves to their jobs and need for more, more, more.
I wonder how Amy's life was when her kids were teens, too. It would be fun to read an update about their lives in the latter years.

I was raised by parents who grew up in the depression. They were frugal in many small ways so they could afford some nice things. We went camping every weekend during the summer and even though it was frugal I loved it! I am probably more frugal than my parents were. I remember my Mom having to urge me to buy clothes for myself when she took me shopping because I would look at the price tags and think they cost too much. This continued all through high school. When it came time for my wedding I of-course planned a frugal one. They didn't force me to economize I just enjoyed it because that was how I was raised.

I now have three teens of my own who are frugal. I have three sons aged 18,16 and 14. They are not constantly asking for things. If they want something they save their money for it. DS16 works a minimum wage job and has saved half of his earnings towards college. He also gives to our church. I do not control his money(he has his own checking acct. and debit card) and I see him putting himself on a budget. If he wants something expensive he doesn't blow a whole check on it he saves for a month and then buys it. That way he can still put money into his savings.

All in all my experience has been that if the parents present frugality in a positive light their children will not resent it.

Originally posted by josephine
I was raised by parents who grew up in the depression. They were frugal in many small ways so they could afford some nice things. We went camping every weekend during the summer and even though it was frugal I loved it! I am probably more frugal than my parents were. I remember my Mom having to urge me to buy clothes for myself when she took me shopping because I would look at the price tags and think they cost too much. This continued all through high school. When it came time for my wedding I of-course planned a frugal one. They didn't force me to economize I just enjoyed it because that was how I was raised.

I now have three teens of my own who are frugal. I have three sons aged 18,16 and 14. They are not constantly asking for things. If they want something they save their money for it. DS16 works a minimum wage job and has saved half of his earnings towards college. He also gives to our church. I do not control his money(he has his own checking acct. and debit card) and I see him putting himself on a budget. If he wants something expensive he doesn't blow a whole check on it he saves for a month and then buys it. That way he can still put money into his savings.

All in all my experience has been that if the parents present frugality in a positive light their children will not resent it.

ITA

Originally posted by jlxian
This is interesting -- because I definitely remember being outraged by her remarks that braces were for cosmetics only. Her viewpoint that they would have been nice for herself and her daughter must have been in one of her books or an interview that I do not have. I am certain read her negative comments in an issue of the newsletter.

In my version of "The Complete Tightwad Gazette" page 820, last paragraph is the following statement by Amy Dacyczyn "One of my children does have a minor cosmetic problem and does want braces. I said yes."

I am not one of Amy's kids either, but I think that I grew up similar to them...

My parents had NO debt ever... We had a good house, my mom worked full time, and my dad stayed home disabled.. We never had the latest fashion, or the newest gadget.. It was simply not in the budget... I never thought of us being "poor", or "deprived".. We (I have one brother two sisters the youngest being only three and a half years younger than me), always played sports, went to dances, and did the things we really wanted.. We did not go to the movies every weekend, wear the latest clothing trends, or wear gobs of makeup and jewelry.. We got bikes with banana seats one year and we thought they were awesome.. Little did we know they were "pieced" together from other bikes.. My dad made homemade syrup just like Amy. We always ate breakfast at home and took our lunches to school, if not then we starved... Usually lunch was a sandwich and a piece of plain chocolate cake. Not much else.. I never felt deprived, and when I did get my first job (and jobs after that), I helped my parents with shcool supplies, and clothing for my brother and sisters... I never thought twice about it.. I think I am rambling now... Don't get me wrong, I always dreamed of certain things, but I was happy with my family... I think we were frugal before a lot of people understood it... LOL..

Originally posted by Hollyhandi
Feel deprived because of the way their parents brought them
up when they get out in the world on their own?

I mean some day they are going to be living with partners who may not want to Dumpster Dive or wash baggies.
Do you think this could affect them in a negative way?

Today's world is alot different than when she wanted this pre 1900 house with attached barn... Just curious...

I think her kids are going to be fine and maybe better than fine for 2 reasons"

#1 she gave them a whole skill set for frugality, they know how to save money, and the choice to use their skills is still theirs. They don't have to, but if they want to, they can.

#2 she gave them understanding of going against mainstream culture. That is hard on teenagers, but wonderful for adults when they grow up and out of the teen gotta be the same as everyone else years. They grow up knowing that their lives don't fall apart because their family tried something different and counter culture which is very freeing.

and another reason

They know that they can do fine without some stuff. Kids who get it "all" never learn that they can wait and save up for something special and nothing is "special" when you can have anything and everything you want courtesy of a parents credit card or good job.

Unfortunately in today's society many people feel that if you don't give your child every material want then they are deprived.

Ever watch the show on MTV called "Sweet Sixteen"? I've glanced at it and it surely makes a good argument why NOT to give your kids everything they want. Those girls are going to continue to grow up thinking that everything comes on money trees and that Prince Charming is just waiting out there to accomodate their spending habits. I have a feeling they will get a rude awakening later in life.

I think Amy D. did just fine. I so agree with the statement that they will at least have the skills to be frugal if they choose to be (which will help a lot in this awfully expensive American economy).

BTW, I am a new member. Love the site!

Lylac

Hi. I think Amy's kids will do just fine. I base that on my own experience. I married a very frugal dh. It was hard for us to adjust to each other, but we did. Basically we had to set out his and hers priorities, do up a budget (he's a bean counter), and give each other an allowance to blow however we wanted - no questions asked. Hasn't hurt us. Every now and then he panics about money, but once he realizes the bills are all being paid without going into debt, he's a happy man.

I think Amy's kids have learned the skills to do these things. The only thing that might hold them back is communication skills. And my guess is they are self-confident enough to have those too!

Further experience needed? I raised dd#1 and #2 in a frugal home. DD#1's fiance (live in bf) is a spendthrift. She is a miser. I've spoken with her about picking things that are important to them and spending as little money as possible to get those things, but get those things she needs to do for her own sense of satisfaction and happiness...and his.

So when he wants to buy specialty role playing pieces/cards she engages him in conversation about how to buy them cheaply. He researches the internet and can find them for half price what it costs locally.

When they are planning date nights, she asks about cheap eats at restaurants and how to make their dates a bit cheaper. We talk about eating earlier in the day, eating at buffets (her fiance eats a lot of food!), and walking the 5 blocks to the movie theatre.

And when she 'needed' braces in high school, we said 'no'. Why? Because they were for one tooth only. Because our entire family (both dh's and mine), has a problem with too many teeth in their jaws, none have had braces and none have suffered any ill side effects from it. And because, frankly, it was for cosmetic purposes, not medical purposes. AND because she didn't want them and was showing no signs of being willing to take care of them. AND because even though the government paid half the cost, we would still be out $2200Cdn. which we didn't have unless we sold the house or stopped eating for 6 months of the year.

The real purpose to being frugal in my mind is to use the money to afford the lifestyle you want. So best sit and figure out what you want in life before you start the frugal game. Because life that is all work and no fun is a boring existence indeed!

My guess would be that some of her adult kids are very frugal and there has to be one in the bunch that is extremely the other way. My sisters are so opposite of each other including about money, you'd never guess that they grew up in the same house.

I think Amy gave her kids a different type of 'education'. An education equipped to survive in this economy, no matter their financial circumstances. They may not choose to use it all the time but their knowledge is there if they need it. I wish I could have been so lucky. Way to go Amy!!

Even if they aren't as frugal as she they do have the skills and knowledge to be that way. How many kids today know how to can, make a solar cooker, they know how to use their hands to build and construct things, they did things with their parents that taught them valuable life lessons for the future. Amy also stressed charity and generousity along with her frugality.

The newletters first came out in 1990 and went from 1996, I loved them and have most of them still in a notebook somewhere. My sister and I used some of here party ideas for her kids we just adjusted them to the personality of the child having the party. To be honest the amount of creativity Amy put into the parties makes them sound like a whole lot of fun. My sister and I like to create things out of "nothing" so her books were a good read for us.

I'll try anything once as long as it isn't illegal, I can't say dangerous cause when I was younger I scared my mother a lot!

Originally posted by jlxian
I have mixed ideas about this. One of few issues I really differed on with her was the "need" for braces on kids teeth. She thought/thinks it is for cosmetics only and in my view not only do you get nice looking teeth, but your whole mouth (and BODY!) is healthier in the end. If her kids had crooked teeth do you suppose they got braces? I'm guessing not -- or they will do it for themselves when they are adults and gone from home.

Now whether they might end up with partners who are not frugal, I'm guessing that because of the way they were raised that their deepest sense of self won't have anything in common with someone who was raised spending money at every turn.

Certainly they have been given tons and tons of love and support from their parents... and that is most definitely the main important issue. It would be extremely interesting to hear about the kids' outlook sometime in the future.

I read in one of Amy's books that she decided that they probably *would* get braces if they were needed or wanted.

Also, if *all* of her children are grown, the youngest ones are just barely out of high school or possibly college. I remember having little ones when her first book came out.

K

I guess we will never know how they felt, we can only speculate about it........