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11-16-2010, 01:15 PM #1
Is it worth it to even try to convince someone?
I'm new to FV and have been browsing these threads. We are still working on BS1 and BS2, a little back and forth as things happen.
Had a conversation recently with in-laws about money. They completely agreed that debt is stupid and then they listed the "only" debts they had: the house payment, one card and a car payment. But the house payment had been refinanced several times to roll in another car payment, new siding, a new kitchen, and new carpet. The only card had another card or two rolled into it to get a better rate, and the car payment had the rest of the other older car payments rolled in to it.
They even had an inheritance that got spent on part of these improvements and other wants, rather than used to pay some things off and put into investments or at least emergency funds.
In their minds, they were being responsible and careful with their money. Yet they talk about how if even one source of income dries up, they are done for.
How do you convince them otherwise? Or do you even try?
- 11-16-2010, 01:20 PM #2
hand them dave rasmeys finanical peasce or total money makeover and let the book convince them .
i always say you cant force people to see it - but you can hand them the tools to see it and at least you know you did your best .11-16-2010, 04:42 PM #3
I agree, you can't really make them believe it until they're truly ready, but you can give them the book and let it do the talking, *if* they're willing to listen.
Now if they come to you for advice, then that's another story. But until then, you can lead a horse to water....11-17-2010, 02:40 PM #4
You've given them the opportunity to learn without being overbearing or "preachy."11-17-2010, 03:29 PM #5
Sounds like someone in my family. I keep hearing how well we are doing (um, it takes work!) and how they "can't" do xyz.
You can't push them. Sometimes people have to fall multiple times before they are ready to change.11-17-2010, 03:37 PM #6
You can't. Just take care of you and hope they learn by example.11-17-2010, 04:28 PM #7
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I agree... Don't force DR on them other than just giving them the book. If they ask questions about how you did it/are doing it, by all means let them know how you are saying no to your wants...etc.
Greebo and I were almost evangelical about DR when we first started to really get a handle on our finances and I'm sure we turned some people off. On the other hand... we see our friends now getting a handle on their spending and starting to build their own future.The Free Spirit Saver who walks the path with Greebo.
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Budget: "Every month! On paper, on purpose!"
Gardening somewhere between Zone 6b and 7a.11-17-2010, 07:56 PM #8
You can't. Just take care of you and hope they learn by example.
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I know this is unpopular advice but, IMO, you really shouldn't even be discussing personal finances with family. Too much potential for drama. Again, just my opinion.11-21-2010, 09:08 AM #9
I think you help them (by telling how you're doing it, giving them a copy of TMMO etc) IF they ask for help- but only then. You can't force people to see how they need to change their ways for a better life, but trying to force it on them will really cause some relationship damage. People don't like to hear they've been doing it 'wrong', true or not, and all of us now doing DR at some point or another were not ready not and did not 'get it'. Everyone comes around n their own time, if they're apt to.Slow and steady wins the race....eventually!
Kill the mortgage! Goal: 12/2023 Left to go: $132,333.70 Extra paid: 2012- $4408.03 2013-$5396.21+ $400 extra towards escrow 2014-$3244.23 + $115 escrow
2015-$1515.84 + $153.54 escrow12-08-2010, 03:09 PM #10
LOL. I have a good friend that just inherited quite a bit of money after the death of a family member. She and her husband had been talking about doing "that Dave Ramsey thing", and now that they have the money, they are going to do it. Right after they buy a new car. (both of their cars are newer than my 2005 Corolla).
Oh, and they paid off ALL their debts, except for one 0% car payment and and the second mortgage. But they're going to do the Dave Ramsey thing next year!
I try to tell them that they are already on BS5 with the inheritance (or they would be if they paid off the HELOC and credit card, and didn't buy the car), but they are going to do all the baby steps!
Of course what is happening is they are talking to the investment guy at the bank that holds their HELOC.12-08-2010, 03:33 PM #11
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Like many others have posted.........let them learn by your example.
It is not your place to run their finances.......and until t hey are ready to change, they will just resent it if you try.
I don't discuss finances with anyone......friend or family......unless they ask first.02-01-2011, 05:21 PM #12
Back to this same family. MAJOR VENT/RANT!
The situation has changed for the worse and still nobody wants to face up to reality. One of the income streams has dried up because of death. The house has a loan on it for up to 3x its worth because they kept rolling things in and refinancing. They have insurance from the death but want to use it ALL up to pay down the house loan but it wouldn't eliminate it. Don't want to save for emergency fund. Don't want to treat life insurance as temporary replacement of lost income for the deceased (you know, like it is supposed to be treated until the family is back on its feet).
I think the only one with financial restraint of any kind was dad, the one who died. Since I have met them seven years ago, they have replaced carpet, replaced flooring, replaced cabinets and got granite counter tops, replaced windows, and replaced the siding, plus new leather sectional, TVs, $400 pedigreed dog that died within 5 years and replaced by another pedigreed one probably as expensive. Most of this happened after dad had a stroke so he had little input into the financial decisions. Part of it was financed by an inheritance - it only paid for most of the counter tops and was entirely used up. The rest was part of the many refinances on the original house loan which is why it is almost 3x the original amount now.
The two with jobs, mom and oldest daughter, are very underemployed because they were just jobs to supplement income and they got very comfortable there and are probably scared to try changing. There are other adult children in the house who aren't working because of mental issues that haven't been resolved in one case and because of the irresponsibility of another family member not living at home in the other.
They are making major money decisions within the first few weeks of death because they just don't want to put anything off. Of course, they don't recognize that they are at their most vulnerable making decisions that quickly. They don't even want to wait a couple of months on deciding to how to use the life insurance. They've made up their minds.
The very first thing we saw after they had some money deposited after the funeral was a shopping trip that didn't bring in much of anything other than individual sized soda bottles for everyone who wanted one. They rarely buy bulk unless TV dinners are on sale. Rarely cook from scratch and often "What's for dinner?" prompts a store run where they pick up a pizza or lasagna or something like that.
It is very frustrating for my husband and I to be the financially responsible ones and see them go into self-destruct mode. We are trying to get church leaders and others to help counsel them and find ways to introduce budgeting and other things ourselves but we're afraid they won't learn fast enough to save themselves.
We will try our best but we are facing reality that we will be watching the financial self-destruction of family and we can't stop it. I'm not asking for suggestions at this point, just needing to vent.02-01-2011, 06:19 PM #13
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Sadly, they will probably have to hit rock bottom before they admit the need to change, if they ever admit it at all.If you could kick in the pants the person responsible for your problems, you wouldn't be able to sit for a month.
Did you know that a 4 year student paying $20,000/year who finances their education graduates with over $103,000 in debt to start? But a student who works and pays cash and takes 6 years to graduate ends with $6,300 in their pocket! So much for "getting a head start by financing!"
Greebo(Nerd Spender): Loving and extremely patiently tolerated husband of ceashels.
WARNING: Y Chromosome behind the keyboard. Adjust your listening filters appropriately!
ThreeTwo mortgages, two oneno car loans, oneno credit cards, and a partridge in pear tree!02-01-2011, 06:41 PM #14
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