Ramsey quotes the Bible...

**kita** · 09-25-2011, 07:39 PM

I have heard Dave Ramsey quote a scripture that states that "when God gives a gift, it has no sorrow added to it". It was in reference to buying too much car...does anyone know the BIBLE VERSE he is quoting?

**mateosbaby** · 09-25-2011, 07:57 PM

I checked every English translation on BibleGateway.com with the words "sorrow" and "gift." The most common one to come up was Esther 9:22, but that wasn't even close. The closest I did come up with was Jeremiah 31:12 New Living Translation (NLT):

12 They will come home and sing songs of joy on the heights of Jerusalem.
They will be radiant because of the Lord’s good gifts—
the abundant crops of grain, new wine, and olive oil,
and the healthy flocks and herds.
Their life will be like a watered garden,
and all their sorrows will be gone.

The other 2 verses that came up in only 1 translation each were exactly opposite that you described. :-/

**Nishu** · 09-25-2011, 08:06 PM

Proverbs 10:22 The blessing of the LORD brings wealth, and he adds no trouble to it.

Proverbs 10:22

Based on the different variations of it, it can mean any number of things.

**HappyMama** · 09-25-2011, 08:08 PM

Originally Posted by Nishu

Proverbs 10:22 The blessing of the LORD brings wealth, and he adds no trouble to it.

Proverbs 10:22

Based on the different variations of it, it can mean any number of things.

That is what I was thinking as well.

**kita** · 09-26-2011, 02:00 AM

Clearly the Proverbs one is what he was quoting. Makes me think....
Thanks to all...

**Incognito** · 10-16-2011, 02:15 PM

No Bible verse should ever be taken out of context.
Consider the Book of Job in reference to this verse, the earthly life of Jesus Christ, the life of Paul and the other disciples and apostles and martyrs.

And anyone who has ever had children knows that along with this greatest of blessings comes times of sorrow. And anyone who has ever been a farmer knows that there are times of abundance, and times of great devastation and loss. Jobs and occupations are all subject to one thing in this life...CHANGE.

These motivational speakers all tend to push their own agenda, and try to back it up by using/abusing/exploiting the authority of the Word of God. But the Word of God is meant to be read in its entirety, with the ultimate goal of one's own salvation and godly lifestyle. Yes, the way we handle our money is definitely an indication of our values and character, but there have been too many charismatic speakers who took Bible verses out of context in order to put pressure on their followers.

I like to evaluate all their sayings in light of this Bible verse:
"And you shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free".

**sinopa27** · 10-17-2011, 05:31 AM

he has been acting mean and now is quoting scripture? Maybe it is a message for himself.

**Greebo** · 10-17-2011, 08:48 AM

Originally Posted by Incognito

No Bible verse should ever be taken out of context.
Consider the Book of Job in reference to this verse, the earthly life of Jesus Christ, the life of Paul and the other disciples and apostles and martyrs.

And anyone who has ever had children knows that along with this greatest of blessings comes times of sorrow. And anyone who has ever been a farmer knows that there are times of abundance, and times of great devastation and loss. Jobs and occupations are all subject to one thing in this life...CHANGE.

These motivational speakers all tend to push their own agenda, and try to back it up by using/abusing/exploiting the authority of the Word of God. But the Word of God is meant to be read in its entirety, with the ultimate goal of one's own salvation and godly lifestyle. Yes, the way we handle our money is definitely an indication of our values and character, but there have been too many charismatic speakers who took Bible verses out of context in order to put pressure on their followers.

I like to evaluate all their sayings in light of this Bible verse:
"And you shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free".

I've heard DR talk about this concept before - usually it's in response to someone saying something about how someone being able to finance a car was a miracle - when they otherwise couldn't afford the car and sure as heck couldn't afford the payments.

He refers to the verse to point out that giving into the temptation to buy too much car on payments that make the budget nearly (or completely) unworkable isn't miraculous, it's stupid, and (in his faith) isn't a gift from his God.

So wrt this proverb and his faith, how is this out of context, or pushing his books/media?

**Dixie** · 10-17-2011, 11:05 AM

Originally Posted by Greebo

He refers to the verse to point out that giving into the temptation to buy too much car on payments that make the budget nearly (or completely) unworkable isn't miraculous, it's stupid, and (in his faith) isn't a gift from his God.

That makes sense, thanks for the explanation, Greebo.

**Nishu** · 10-18-2011, 11:52 AM

Originally Posted by Greebo

So wrt this proverb and his faith, how is this out of context, or pushing his books/media?

It kind of looked like a selective interpretation to me. Depending on the book used, it could also mean that we should not give ourselves credit for the gifts that God gives us, which is an interpretation that I kind of like. It's kind of hard to tell without reading the text around it.

Here's another, which I don't see as being relevant to the situation at all.

22 The blessing of the LORD brings wealth,
without painful toil for it.

I've also heard people quote Jesus Christ as saying "The poor will always be with you" as though it's some kind of prophecy and a reason not to try to deal with poverty. In the context of the story though, someone had tried to wash Jesus' feet with some kind of expensive foot scrub, when someone pointed out that that designer foot scrub could have been easily sold and used to care for the poor. Jesus says in response that the poor will always be with them, and that he would be there only for a short time so go ahead and splurge. It really changes the interpretation of the quote, imo.

I guess it all depends on your point of view.

**Greebo** · 10-18-2011, 11:57 AM

Originally Posted by Nishu

I guess it all depends on your point of view.

No doubt, and as an atheist (and an outspoken one), as far as I'm concerned, it's all mystic whoo doo.

But in the context of the Christian faith, which would you imagine Christians would rather believe - that their God would "bless" them with a "miracle" of a car loan that cripples their budget for years, or that in reality such a "miracle" is just human stupidity with a serious dose of rationalization or at the least, foolishness?

In the Christian context, DR can point to these crippling "miracles" and say, "No, if it's making your life worse it wasn't ever from God" and stop having to explain it further.