Adult Students: May I ask some questions for a paper?

[Minner77]

Hello, all!
I feel rather guilty... this will be only my second post (after some lurking), but I just noticed this Education section and it occurred to me that maybe some of you have some opinions that could help me finish some papers I'm workin on for my Master's in Adult Ed.

The two classes I'm taking now are Distance Learning (what I hope to specialize in) and Sociology of Adult Ed. I was lucky enough that both professors accepted proposals for papers that are actually rather similar (I feel a bit smug, too, I confess!), greatly reducing my research load. (Nice, because I still have a book review and the regular assignments, too!)

Anyway, if anyone would be so kind as to forgive my boldness in being so new and yet still looking for input, here's what I'm trying to find out:

PAPER#1: What are the characteristics of a successful distance learner? If you've been taking/have taken distance learning -- online, via CDs, via computer, via teleconferencing, whatever!, did you employ any strategies that particularly helped you to succeed? Examples: posting your calendars so the whole family knew when you needed the computer; setting up study groups with other students also taking the classes; making backup arrangements in case of computer failure; scheduling time in the private carrels in the library to ensure some peace and quiet.

PAPER#2: Respecting the "Adult" in "Adult Learner." It's quite different going to school as an adult with a spouse, kids, and likely a full-time job. Adults also have a great deal of life experience that instructors must respect -- they're not 18-yr olds (no offense!) who've never had to slug it out in the world. What can instructors and Institutes of Higher Education do to help adults in particular? Were you ever treated so much as a child that you became angry or frustrated? Examples: be understanding of conflicting work schedules, perhaps allowing more make up work if necessary; polling each class to determine each one's familiarity with the subject at hand; ensuring child care is available.

I would truly appreciate any and all responses! My papers are due Dec 6, but I'm hoping to have them done before then to allow time for polishing -- and for figuring out the blasted, evil APA citation styles they require.

Thanks in advance!
Kindest regards,
Mary

[Kimberlina]

Well, I'm not currently an adult student, but I have been, and your second question speaks to me. (Question 1- well, I was a lousy distance learner. I am very hands on and doing math on the computer just didn't cut it for me.)

The second question, though, like I said, I had some issues with a chem. professor I had once. He totally didn't respect that the vast majority of students in his EVENING class were people with families and jobs who had been out of high school for a long time. Actually, I think that out of the 30 or so people in the class, only one was a new HS grad.

He expected us all to remember things from high school chemistry. I was probably the youngest "adult" student in the class, and even for me, it had been 10 years. Who the heck remembers chemistry from ten years ago? Teachers need to remember that when they are teaching intro classes, they can't assume everyone remembers what they took in high school. They can't give the massive workloads to their evening adult-learners that they would give to full-time college students. I think this applies more in community colleges. That isn't to say that adult learners should be expected to do less, but maybe give them a little more lead time for papers, etc.

I actually dropped that chem class because that professor was so darn condescending. (There were other issues, to be sure- I suffer from panic disorder, and when I told him so, and requested certain things from him, which were not things that were out of line or unreasonable- just things like," please don't write a problem on the board and then immediately ask me the answer- I don't do well when put on the spot, even if I know the answer. Anyway, he told me that he was going to do what he bloody well pleased and I could just deal with it, which is a blatant violation of the Americans with Disabilities act- I know this for sure as my MIL is a professor.)

Anyway, I mostly dropped the class because of the assumption that we all knew what the heck he was talking about (most of us had to go to our lab professor to get any help at all) and because of the condescension. I don't know if that helps at all, but it's your if it does.

[Minner77]

Kimberly --

"He expected us all to remember things from high school chemistry. I was probably the youngest "adult" student in the class, and even for me, it had been 10 years. "

Thanks so much! That thought alone was a huge help. I hadn't really thought about that. I've been out of school since 1983 myself, but I sure haven't been asked to remember high school chemistry. Yikes!

My twist is that I'm just about the only non-teacher: my B.S. is in Business, so there are a number of terms and concepts I'm not familiar with. My advantage here is that I'm doing my course entirely online, so I have time to research before responding.

And... I find it absolutely horrid that the professor was in such flagrant violation of decency - not to mention the law! His tenure probably protected him..... 'guess your MIL would know better than I. What a shame that YOU left the class, and not him!

Blessings,
Mary

[hollyhill]

I am not an adult learner right now but my Dh is! And I totally second what kimberly had to say. Dh ran into that constantly the first year even though there were only 4 students in his course right out of highschool.

I know Dh could add alot of information for your paper but he is drowning in work right now with out a minute to spare for anyone. Sorry about that!

[MandiDawn]

I'm not a student anymore, but when I was, I worked full-time all thru college, while alternating between full and part-time studies. My biggest pet peeve was when we needed to do stuff "out-of-class" and I couldn't because I had to go to work. In my technical writing class, I spent hours writing a manual for the school newspaper. I interviewed many people, studied their current (outdated) manual and came up with what I belive was a great finished product. My teacher had mentioned that it would be a good idea to get a picture of the entire newspaper staff and put that in my report. Well yeah, that is a good idea, but they met while I was at work, and THEY couldnt' all get together at any other time. So I didn't get my picture. I was not going to call off work to get one picture. I got a lower grade on the project, and her only comment was "you should have a picture of them". Yeah, 5 years later, still smarting about that. She didn't understand that I don't have all the time in the world for stuff like that.
I have a hundred examples like that, but that's the one that upset me the most, because I felt the grade I got was not fair.

[FreesiaE]

I thought I'd respond to #2. I'm afraid I may be going against the grain though. I did some (4 semesters) of graduate school pt, and worked ft. I took classes in a field completely outside of my major in undergrad. For the amount of my own hard earned $$$ I was paying, I wanted to learn. I wanted to be in class the whole time (each class was 4 hours on Sat., I took 2 at a time) and really, really get in depth with subjects. However, inevitably around 3 hours into it, we would be released. Um, hello, I paid for 4 hours, and that it was I want. I felt that many students just were taking these classes for the heck of it, not b/c they really wanted to learn. I went prepared for a rigerous education in a scientific field and was very disappointed about how little I learned overall. I think I'm the type of student who like to take copious notes, turn in a grade every class, and thrives off of good lecture. I'd rather really learn and get a B than cruise and get an A but not really know anything.

[Minner77]

Dear MandiDawn --

No respect for adult learners, huh? Again, great info for what I'm writing. Too - I'll be teaching a course in Technical Writing at the local community college beginning in January, and you can bet I'll remember your input! Thanks so much!

And -- I'd be still smarting, too! I still haven't forgiven a Spains professor for giving me a B when I had a 94% average, or an acounting prof for refusing to change a grade (when I showed him the marked up test proving I was right!) because he said he trusted whatever his Graduate Assistants did. And I've been out of college for 22 years! (Hey, these classes really affected my GPA!)


Blessings,
Mary

[Minner77]

Dear FreesiaE --

Not going against the grain -- good stuff!
I really think there is a huge difference between the (average) adult learner and the (average) student right out of high school. I know I was guilty, starting school as a 17-yr old, of being thrilled when we got out early or when someone managed to get the prof off track so we could talk instead of learn.

But I took a non-credit (for me, as I already had a degree) class in Writing for Publication at a local community college when I was in my 30's. Normally it was mostly adult learners, but this class was mostly young un's. I tell you, I was absolutely incensed at how much time was wasted, especially because the other students were quite adept at getting the teacher off track. I paid good money to go, and had to do serious juggling of work and day care and driving through rush hour traffic in both downtown St. Paul AND downtown Mpls just to get there, so I was not, not amused.

Again, I'll make sure to keep these points in mind as I write my papers, and beginning my own humble teaching career!

Blessings,
Mary