Is this normal?

[Jamauk]

My DS 1 (Ben) hit his terrible twos at 18 months. Three was worse than two (which I was prepared for) and the day he turned 4 he was my sweet sweet angel again.

He just turned 5 in March and boy does he have an attitude. His preschool teacher told me it was normal for 5 year olds......but HOLY COW!!!!

I am so sick of his smart mouth, his attitude that he is the only person that matters in this house and that he needs to get his way 24/7. He seems to have it in his head that listening to Mommy & Daddy is completely optional. If he wants my attention and I'm doing something else he has got it in his head that its acceptable to just walk up to me and hit my arm or take my book/magazine/cup of coffee, etc...out of my hands and start pulling on me.

I hate being a screaming raving lunatic of a mother, but that seems to be the only way to get him to take me seriously. When I speak to him in a calm voice, or ask him to do something he rarely even acknowledges that I'm speaking. Time outs seem to have little effect, we've tried spanking ~ with little result. I've sat him down to talk to him about it and tried to figure out if anything else was going on....nothin'.

Has anyone else been through this and if so....did you guys live to see the 6th birthday?!?!

Thanks in Advance!

[Greebo]

I'm not a parent, so ... take w/ a grain of salt.

But are there things you can take away from him? What toys or activities does he really REALLY love? Can you tell him, 'if you do this again, I will take THAT away from you until you learn to behave properly'?

[rachelj]

so your a screaming raving lunatic mother too sometimes? Phew, I feel SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO much better!!!

I wish I had some great answers. It seems that my ds (turned 4 in April) is really great for others but at home wants to push all the buttons - like hitting his little sister and then gets mad when she finally retaliates. What makes my situation so much worse is that I am by vocation and training a Marriage and Family therapist. So when I do my "mommy monster" yell I feel so bad and then want to hit my head against a wall b/c I should know better. SO MUCH EASIER SAID THAN DONE, THO, HUH?

[Jamauk]

I'm not a parent, so ... take w/ a grain of salt.

But are there things you can take away from him? What toys or activities does he really REALLY love? Can you tell him, 'if you do this again, I will take THAT away from you until you learn to behave properly'?

Half of the toys he owns are in the garage in a "time out"

I hate to do this, though...because it punishes his brother too! (90% of the toys are "share" toys)

He has a "Leapster" video game and he whacked his brother in the head with it last week. Its now locked in my desk drawer.

[rachelj]

Half of the toys he owns are in the garage in a "time out"

I hate to do this, though...because it punishes his brother too! (90% of the toys are "share" toys)

He has a "Leapster" video game and he whacked his brother in the head with it last week. Its now locked in my desk drawer.

Might work better if you let the little brother play with it while you supervise and big brother "has to watch" ???

[Greebo]

Might work better if you let the little brother play with it while you supervise and big brother "has to watch" ???

Oh I LIKE that! That's REALLY gonna burn the little brat!

[itsahumanzoo]

Mine's only two, but what I like to do instead of yelling, is put my hands on his face so he is looking at me while I talk calmly to him. Otherwise I am trying to yell over his yelling and it is not fun. It seems like when I hold his face it also calms him down as well.

[Iansmommy]

I don't remember either of my older 2 going through a stage like that when they were 5, but every kid is different. Last school year my then 8 year old was acting like a 13 year old going through puberty. She had such an attitude and still does. It could be stuff he is picking up from school. My DD is oblivious to punishments unless it is grounding. My DS6 is very sensative and if you look at him wrong he falls apart.

After babbling on, what I was trying to get at is every kid is different, so in that respect it is normal.

This too will pass and you will have your sweet boy back, even if it is only until the next stage hits.

[Momto2Boyz]

Oh man do I feel your pain!

I have been through this once with my now 7 year old, and I am starting it all over again with my 4 1/2 year old.

We tried everything from time outs, taking toys away, to spanking and nothing worked. Until one day I stumbled upon something miraculous!

I won't say that it will work for everyone, but it has worked wonders with my boys! I was doing a guided meditation over the internet one day and my boys walked in and wanted to try it too. So I searched the same site and found the children's meditations. So I started using it when my 7 year old was 5, and he has done them ever since.

I use them in place of time out when it is appropriate. When they are getting out of control yelling, screaming, fighting. I make them lay down (this took a few times of doing it...then they knew they would enjoy it, so they didn't argue) on the living room rug and I would turn on one of the meditations.

It would leave them feeling much calmer than before they started and they always had a much better attitude after the fact. I basically used it in place of time out.

My suggestion is to try it and see if it helps, do it with them the first couple of times, and make them think that it is something "special" to do when they need to calm down and they might enjoy it. Or, it might not work...but it's worth a shot!

It works great calming down for bedtime too!

Here is the website that I use, these are 5 meditations just for kids!

http://www.learningmeditation.com/children.htm

[Moor]

jessica, what i am about to tell you is sacred, so don't repeat it to others! lol

first of all, when he takes your things, do not bend to his level. that is what he is wanting. when he tries this with you, grab it back and walk away. if he starts hitting you, then take him by the arm, walk him to the fridge and put his nose on it. make him stand there.
the first time that i did this, it was a battle of wills. but let me tell you, it worked. my fridge is white, i took a dry erase marker and made a circle.make the circle just a little higher than where their nose would normally be on the fridge, that way they have to work to keep it in the circle. i told my kids to keep their nose in the circle. if they moved or if they smudged the circle, then they would have to stay there longer.
it took a couple of times. but the first time that i did it, it took me almost three hours to get my ds to stand there. but i was going to win that battle. he fought me on it tooth and nail. but you know what, he ended up giving in. he yelled, hit, and tried to bite me. but i just calmly deflected everything, and kept picking him up and putting him right back in the same spot.
as to taking his toys, that works great. but since they are "shared" make him sit on the couch while the younger son plays with them. that always worked with me.
as to the hitting, every time he hits you, hit him back. i know that this sounds awful, but let me tell you, it works! i don't mean clobber him. but if he smacks you on the arm, then smack him back. according to childrens services, this is acceptable, as it teaches them that hitting hurts and if they don't want it done to them, they should not do it to others. because a consequence of hitting is getting hit back.
when my kids yelled at me, instead of yelling back, i walked away. i went into another room and closed the door. they will get tired of yelling at a closed door and soon calm down. i found that if i walked into their room, they would follow, so i would corner them in their room and then walk out and close the door behind me, leaving them in their room screaming!

beleive me, it does get better. and yes all of mine made it past 5. mine are now 19, 18, 12, and 9.
hope that this helps!

[Michelle]

I went through this with Kathryn. I am convinced it had something to do with her starting preschool where she could see the other children misbehaving. It did get much better when she turned six.

Now I've just got to deal with the occasional tween attitude

[Frugal Nurse]

Okay.. you KNOW he is testing his independence and testing YOU for your limits. His age that you described is synomous with Erikson's Stages of Development

Infancy: Birth to 18 Months
Ego Development Outcome: Trust vs. Mistrust (will my mom feed me or not?)
Basic strength: Drive and Hope

Early Childhood: 18 Months to 3 Years
Ego Development Outcome: Autonomy vs. Shame (can I potty train? or not?)
Basic Strengths: Self-control, Courage, and Will

Play Age: 3 to 5 Years
Ego Development Outcome: Initiative vs. Guilt (If I do this? am I still okay? or not?)
Basic Strength: Purpose

During this period we experience a desire to copy the adults around us and take initiative in creating play situations. We make up stories with Barbie's and Ken's, toy phones and miniature cars, playing out roles in a trial universe, experimenting with the blueprint for what we believe it means to be an adult. We also begin to use that wonderful word for exploring the world—"WHY?"
While Erikson was influenced by Freud, he downplays biological sexuality in favor of the psychosocial features of conflict between child and parents. Nevertheless, he said that at this stage we usually become involved in the classic "Oedipal struggle" and resolve this struggle through "social role identification." If we're frustrated over natural desires and goals, we may easily experience guilt.
The most significant relationship is with the basic family.

School Age: 6 to 12 Years
Ego Development Outcome: Industry vs. Inferiority (can I do this? learn this? or not?)
Basic Strengths: Method and Competence

Adolescence: 12 to 18 Years
Ego Development Outcome: Identity vs. Role Confusion (I am separate, but who am I?)
Basic Strengths: Devotion and Fidelity

Young adulthood: 18 to 35
Ego Development Outcome: Intimacy and Solidarity vs. Isolation (I want a spouse)
Basic Strengths: Affiliation and Love

Middle Adulthood: 35 to 55 or 65 Ego Development Outcome: Generativity vs. Self absorption or Stagnation (I want to repay the community)
Basic Strengths: Production and Care

Late Adulthood: 55 or 65 to Death
Ego Development Outcome: Integrity vs. Despair (did I do all that I wanted to do in this life? or not?)
Basic Strengths: Wisdom

Link to a more indepth discussion on those stages: http://www.learningplaceonline.com/s...ze/Erikson.htm


In a nutty shell, each human needs to pass through these stages. Maybe animals too, according to Ceasar Milan, the Dog Whisperer, dogs seem to need to go through stages. Have you noticed when psychological probems arise with dogs.. he brings them back a few stages to start all over?

Anyway.. one must pass through successfully. Your job as a parent is to make sure the child moves through the stages - successfully. For some reason, this important detail was left out of the parenting manual we were born with.

Sometimes things happen to people along the way and for some reason (abuse or neglect - And I am NOT referring to you - silly woman) the person got stuck. The person can not move onto the next stage of development. Example: if a teen was unable to develop an identity - it is presumed as an adult, that person will have great difficulty forming intimate relationships - simply because there is no self-identity (in simple terms - if you do not love yourself, you can not love others).

So that being said.. your son is very healthy and moving along just fine.

Mom? what about you?

Discipline-wise, being firm and consistant is what he needs.
You know what you want of him.. right?
He wants to please you.
Soooo... give him positive feedback. Not negative. I know I don't need to explain what that is.
Obviously the punishment (negative feedback) is not working.

Tell the little rascal...
"hey! you're five now! You're a big kid now!- it's time for big kids rules with you....Are you ready for them? They're really hard - but I know you can do them."
and list the rules. [Little rascal] what will be consequences if you can't follow the rules? (don't surprise him with a consequence he was unaware of - it has no meaning to him other than. you're an unfair mother.

Of course he won't remember the rules and will need reinforcement. That's normal. He can not remember them. Really. Patience mom, patience.

"Remember [little rascal] there was a rule about that". calm. firm. and NO wavering!

I took the liberty of quoting his age. Notice at his age group he is learning and soaking up the environment. He is mimicking what he sees. Take note of that and the calmness you project (or the screaming) will have a direct influence on him for the rest of his life. Pretty darn scary job you have ...huh?

Also note that little cute bugger is going to be six soon.. Six starts the stage of... 'the parents no longer have the voice of authority they once had" (Son may be transitioning to that- the age range is just that... no real defined age) Be ready for it - embrace - accept it and let him grow.


You HAD to know mine was going to be long.. right?

[Starlight9803]

I feel your pain! DD was an almost "perfect" baby and toddler, few temper tantrums, not whiny or clingy until she turned 5. All at once she turned into this little demon LOL. Admitedly, she was starting school, DS had just been born, etc, so it was a stressful time. She did eventually get better, but now I'm getting the little preteen attitude @@.

[iida]

I hate being a screaming raving lunatic of a mother

You made me laugh. I think you have noticed that we don´t often see things in a similar way, but I have to say, that I enjoy reading your posts. You are so funny and smart.

I don´t remember my kids being difficult when they were five. But at six they were both moody, easily irritated, often sulking and even crying. I think it had something to do with the "last year as a little child" before school starts at seven.

[Izzy0906]

Oh man do I feel your pain!

I have been through this once with my now 7 year old, and I am starting it all over again with my 4 1/2 year old.

We tried everything from time outs, taking toys away, to spanking and nothing worked. Until one day I stumbled upon something miraculous!

I won't say that it will work for everyone, but it has worked wonders with my boys! I was doing a guided meditation over the internet one day and my boys walked in and wanted to try it too. So I searched the same site and found the children's meditations. So I started using it when my 7 year old was 5, and he has done them ever since.

I use them in place of time out when it is appropriate. When they are getting out of control yelling, screaming, fighting. I make them lay down (this took a few times of doing it...then they knew they would enjoy it, so they didn't argue) on the living room rug and I would turn on one of the meditations.

It would leave them feeling much calmer than before they started and they always had a much better attitude after the fact. I basically used it in place of time out.

My suggestion is to try it and see if it helps, do it with them the first couple of times, and make them think that it is something "special" to do when they need to calm down and they might enjoy it. Or, it might not work...but it's worth a shot!

It works great calming down for bedtime too!

Here is the website that I use, these are 5 meditations just for kids!

http://www.learningmeditation.com/children.htm

My kid has an attitude like a teenager. Slamming doors, screaming she hates me etc.. Time outs, useless, sitting in her room for an hour, no toys or tv, she didn't care. Tried one of these meditations, great! She calmed right. Now she does it herself before bed and when she gets angry to calm down. She loves concentrating on her breathing. She's amazingly been much nicer (and so have I). She even taught it to my parents. I know I know, sounds weird but it really made her feel so grown-up to do it and calmed her down so much.