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Feeling Trapped - Forced to make fast decision - Absolutely Terrified

4K views 26 replies 13 participants last post by  marjorie 
#1 ·
My story is the same as many others...

Previous debt from previous bad marriage where husband was laid-off and refused to look for other work, forcing me to make ends meet on a part-time job and credit cards.

Made some poor decisions in current marriage which landed us in deeper debt.

Job changes with lesser pay and unable to make ends meet any more.

I am a Christian and am struggling between the guilt of bad choices and guilt of asking God to help us find a way out of it. Hubby thinks I should declare chapter 7, but I am absolutely terrified of that step, even though things are so tight right now that I feel FORCED to take that step. I've read SOOOO many conflicting things about the process and destruction of bankruptcy and I don't entirely trust the lawyer we went to see for help.

I tried to join Dave Ramsey's forums, but he charges to join his forums and that's money I don't have right now, so that didn't make sense.

My Christian principles are keeping me from making a drastic decision like that right now because I feel it is wrong to wipe out a debt that I owe, even though the lawyer told us (rightfully-so) that it is CRIMINAL to be charging us nearly 30% interest and that is equally as immoral as me not paying back my debts!

We struggle SO HARD to make the minimum payments, but the interest is drowning us and because we have to juggle bills every month, we can never get any help from the creditors when we BEG them for lower interest rates or SOME forms of forgiveness. No matter how hard we try to make ends meet, even down to living on Ramen noodles and tap water, we can't seem to make a dent in the bucket, no matter how hard we try.

Hubby is dead set on the bankruptcy, but I am BEYOND absolutely terrified of that decision. He loves me and will stand by whatever decision I make, but I just can't wrap my mind around such a HUGE, damaging decision like that!

I feel so trapped and hopeless and frustrated and terrified and lost right now and just don't know WHERE to turn. Any form of counseling services cost MONEY that we don't have. Hubby says that all "debt consolidation" companies are frauds and don't work, and we've discovered evidence of that in various places on the internet. We don't know WHAT to believe in all the plethora of information out there in cyber space. We don't know WHERE to start.

I am PRAYING for a sign in the sky to tell me to file or not to file for bankruptcy. Short of selling everything we own to make a dent in the debt and living in a box under a bridge, I don't know what to do or where to go and the idea of filing bankruptcy is so terrifying for me that I just can't seem to make myself go that direction.

Feeling so lost and helpless right now and VERY VERY discouraged.
Thanks for "listening."
 
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#2 ·
I am so sorry that you are going through this..

i completely understand....my story is

we own two peices of property...one is completely ours and we make mortgage payments on it...the other is an inheritance from my dad and all three of us kids own it...it is on the market now going on two years with no interest in it...we started out at one price and lowered it by 20,000 and still no interest... the real estate agent says it is priced to sell and that we shouldn't go any further....at this time i simply to go any lower just the idea that my dad worked hard for this peice of property...still have to pay a third of the upkeep taxes etc on this peice of property...Hubby cannot work due to health issues and on my income we are having a hard time paying our mortgagte...my two brothers have told me to let my house go and just move in the property until it sells which would be almost never and if i decide i want it then i would give them each 20,000 dollars for it...making me have a mortgage of $40,000 which is far lower than what i have now...we have struggled now for two years but have somehow pulled it off and have been able to keep the house we live in...but it is a struggle...i made a payment last week an had to pray that God would actually let money fall from the sky so i could have money to get back and forth to work with....pay day is wednesday of this week but some bills had to go not being paid so that i could make that payment....dh just doesn't want to let this house go....I understand where he is coming from but I hate living from day to day. I have run it by him that maybe we should try and sell this house and if it sells than it is a sign from above what should happen...however he refuses....but i know that if we continue to live this way we will lose it anyhow as my income is just not enough to live on.....I try and try to be as frugal as i can but dh and kids are not on board... i mean seriously there isn't any blow money so its not like they are spending frivuously...however if you leave a room shut the light off... washing out a dish..you dont need to leave the water running for 15 minutes for one dish...simple things like that and they simply do not get it...if i push it dh gets frustrate with me but i am simply to the point of frustration right now myself...i personally think we are never going to go forward living like this...and i don't know when to say enough is enough...any ideas....
 
#3 ·
I've been in a very similar situation and I understand your feelings of guilt.

I was able to make a consumer proposal through a bankruptcy trustee to avoid bankruptcy. In essence, you offer the people you owe a percentage of what you owe them as opposed to going bankrupt. The payments you make are based on your income. I'm not sure if that is available where you are - I'm in Canada. I'm just waiting to hear if my proposal is accepted or not.

I'm also a Christian and discussed my situation with clergy. They offered some interesting perspective.

~ Did you enter into the debt with the intention to pay it? yes

~ Did you try everything in your power to make good on the debts? yes

~ Were there some circumstances beyond your direct control that caused you to be unable to pay? yes

Does God forgive mistakes? YES

If you can't pay, you can't pay. Do everything in your power to help others once you get out of this devastating situation. Pray for guidance and forgiveness and then do what you must.

You have to have basic necessities like food and shelter. You deserve to get out from under this burden.

My thoughts are with you.
 
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#4 ·
I feel for you and please hang in there. We are all here to listen and many of us have already been there done that or are there and doing it now. (me!)

YOU CAN DO THIS. You can both stay a team and get through this together, its commendable that you are both trying to fix it. Not everyone does. Not everyone feels the weight on their shoulders and the ownership of their problem like you both do.

If you are comfortable with it, you could start a thread posting your current income, bills, and budget. People here can give you constructive criticism and tips that maybe you haven't thought of yet. (sometimes its easier to see the situation when looking in from the outside) Many people on here are SUPER frugal and their insight is so valuable. They think of things the rest of us would not.

(you don't have to put company names on the bills when you post, just write "car payment $x.00, house payment $.99 etc.)

It really helped me when I posted my budget, even if I didn't listen to ALL the advice at the time, it is there for me when I'm ready for that next step.
 
#6 ·
I'm sorry for your situation and I can understand your fears and guilt. Others have given good advice.

I just wanted to say the I don't think all debt consolidation companies are frauds. A relative of mine is working with something like that and has paid over $33,000 in 2 1/2 years. The company negotiated lower interest rates for them and worked with the creditors to set up a single payment that the company then pays to the creditors. It seems to be working well for my relative.
 
#7 ·
WOW THANK YOU ALL !! It is such a refreshing blessing to receive such understanding and support! Daisy, THANK YOU for directly addressing my spiritual dilemma as that is on the biggest difficulties for me right now - feeling like I am stealing from my debtors, even though they are wronging ME just as much, I still feel a responsibility to do my part. Your encouragement and hugs have been such a blessing. I started this thread amid tears and it is so comforting to know that there really IS a glimmer of hope out there.

THANK YOU ALL !!!
 
#13 ·
I have been a member there as well:)
 
#16 ·
Great I look forward to it. Just research, pray, and be calm I hate to see anyone jump into the wrong decision or from the pan to the fire...

Just think of it this way: In the middle of the night, you turn on a light to walk around, and don't just bump around in the dark knocking things over or getting hurt. Keep calm, pray and "turn the light" on for clarity with the issue. Seek and you shall find. The answers will come maybe just not in the next hour :)

Hugs and Blessings,
 
#17 ·
Yes understand that....look up his book. ;)
 
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#18 ·
ah - Thank you. Will definitely do that. ;)

And thank you for the clarity thoughts. Right now I feel like I am forced into a decision for lack of options and I am trying to just hold myself together through this crisis. I'm feeling SO GUILTY because of the pressure this puts on my DH as well, because it doesn't seem fair for him to be forced to pay for MY bad debts - and ours together as well, but mine are greater. The guilt and pressure is overwhelming and I am desperate for help and a light at the end of the tunnel. I greatly appreciate your words of caution and comfort.

THANK YOU.
 
#19 ·
I would look into a reputable non-profit credit counseling company in your area. They may be able to get your interest lower. They may also recommend bankruptcy.

Juggling bills each month must be very stressful. I hope you can figure out what will be best for you.
 
#20 ·
Beware of debt relief agencies. Consumer Credit is a good company in my state and I think they are nationwide.

Other companies take your money and never help. Its a huge danger. I do bankruptcies and see clients regularly that are in bankruptcy due to having been cheated by consolidation companies. The ploy is that you pay them $xxx per month, have all your bills directed to them and they will work out settlements. The usual thing that happens is they take most of the money for their fees and allow any surplus to accumulate in an account. When your bills fall around 3 months behind some cc companies will start making settlement offers. If there is enough money they will pay off that company while the rest of your bills go even further behind. You become aware of the problem when you're served lawsuit papers. The irony of this is the cc people would make that same offer to settle to you once you fall behind. It comes with your bill or a letter from the cc company and is not something "arranged" by the debt consolidation people. Usual offer is "if you pay $xx within the next 20 days we'll accept that as full payment". Its usually something in the neighborhood of 1/3 off.

Bankrupty is not a picnic but sometimes its the only reasonable option. If you are sued, a judgment entered and wages or bank accounts garnished, you will be unable to pay any of your bills. Its better to be proactive and file bankruptcy before things reach that point. If you do not like or trust the attorney you saw, find a different one.

Regarding whether or not to sell your house and move into the one co-owned with your brothers, what if that house sells? You'd then be homeless. Unless you have a written agreement with your brothers allowing that house to come off the market and you pay them rent for their share it doesn't sound like too good of an idea. Murphy's law would say as soon as you move in it would sell!

Consumer Credit here will do a free financial consult and tell you straight out whether or not they can help you, how much you'd have to pay each month, or that they can't help and you should file bankruptcy.
 
#22 ·
Ok, hubby and I sat down and did a real quick, REALLY rough calculation of our situation which breaks down (very roughly) as thus:


  • Estimated Monthly Income - $4600
($2157 of that total is absolute required household expenses)
  • Estimated Monthly Outflow - $5116
  • Estimated Total Debt - $74,000 (gasp)


The total debt includes credit cards, loans, etc.

We quickly estimated some areas where we could cut costs and basically live on pasta, potatoes, and ZERO luxuries or extra amenities and I know we can find other areas to cut, but the impact would barely be a drop in the bucket (if that!).

Hubby still believes the answer is bankruptcy, but I am seeking "wisdom from the masses" to find other answers before making that final decision.

WHERE DO WE START ??!!
WHERE DO WE GO FROM HERE ??!!

I'm hoping for some helpful direction from those who have gone before us to face this seemingly impossible and helpless challenge.
 
#23 ·
Ok, hubby and I sat down and did a real quick, REALLY rough calculation of our situation which breaks down (very roughly) as thus:


  • Estimated Monthly Income - $4600
($2157 of that total is absolute required household expenses)
Are you certain about that? So many people think certain expenses are MUSTS, when they are really wants - cable TV, lawn service, etc.
  • Estimated Monthly Outflow - $5116
  • Estimated Total Debt - $74,000 (gasp)


The total debt includes credit cards, loans, etc.

We quickly estimated some areas where we could cut costs and basically live on pasta, potatoes, and ZERO luxuries or extra amenities and I know we can find other areas to cut, but the impact would barely be a drop in the bucket (if that!).

Again - are you sure? Seems like even a drop in the bucket would get the snowball rolling. and once you start doing SOMETHING, you gain empowerment to do more.

Hubby still believes the answer is bankruptcy, but I am seeking "wisdom from the masses" to find other answers before making that final decision.

WHERE DO WE START ??!! Start with ACCURATE numbers, not rough estimates. You have to know exactly where you stand on income, outgo, and debt.
WHERE DO WE GO FROM HERE ??!! Make a budget and stick to it. Pay the 4 walls first (food, house, utilities, health) . . . .

I'm hoping for some helpful direction from those who have gone before us to face this seemingly impossible and helpless challenge.

Yes, I've been there - still digging out, but at least I'm not in a panic anymore . . and we have a few wants, along with our needs.
I answered some of your points above, in read.
 
#24 ·
Thank you Sunshine. I couldn't figure out how to quote the quote to respond to your red items, so I'll just take them one at a time....

We did look at our absolute household expenses, which include the very basic things like Rent, Electric, Water, Gas, etc. Yes, there are areas we can cut like, less heat, shorter showers, etc. Hubby works from home and requires cable access for his job, which is reimbursed 100% from corporate, so that doesn't count. We don't even watch TV and only have the service for his telecommute to work. No extra amenities like lawn care or other services as we do all those things ourselves. Our house is large and old and drafty, so in the winter, we close down rooms, close the heat vents in those rooms, line the bottoms of the doors to prevent heat-loss, etc.

Our numbers were actually pretty accurate, as we wrote down every monthly payment and balance. Obviously we have to get it down to the penny when it comes to the final budget system, but we wanted to get a rough calculation. Hubby works well with spread-sheets that make absolutely no sense to me, so I had to sit down and make a long, hand-written tally for myself to comprehend and UNDERSTAND.

Thanks again for the great suggestions and advice. Please keep it coming!!
 
#25 ·
I highly, highly suggest you find Dave Ramsey's books at your local library.

In addition to life changing advice, he also gives sample letters for the cc companies.

chances are; You can DO this without filing bankruptcy.
 
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#27 ·
Back in the day I had 2 little kids, no child support, and no education. I worked at a job that had benefits but low pay. So low I figured out I'd actually have more cash if we were on Welfare. I wasn't into that whole idea, so I began to babysit during the day, and then worked 4-midnight as well. I was always exhausted, never enough money and the debt kept rising, or at least it felt that way. Many of my credit cards were absurdly high interest. I figured out the total debt I owed, and the money I had available for repayment each month. It wasn't much. I took my list of debts, and figured out the percentage of the total debt each line item represented. Next I wrote a letter to each company, stating my income, what was avilable for debt repayment and the portion of debt and debt repayment money was avilable to that company. I also stated that if the company didn't want to go with my plan that was fine, but I was going to pay off those who were willing to work with me first. I got more cooperation than I expected once those I owed understood that I had a plan and a strong desire to make everything right. Paying everyone off didn't happen overnight. I always put any extra cash toward the debt with the lowest dollar amount, which helped me feel as though I was making progress. Some of the companies who didn't want to work with me eventually fell by the wayside, or offered settlements lower than anything I'd have considered asking for. HTH Let me know if you have questions...
 
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