Income did it determine family size-LONG with vent

[Sheila Q]

Hello everyone,

I have a question. There is alot going on in my life right now my mom suffered a stroke and sadly instead of making my brother and I closer we have been fighting with a huge fight at my mother's the other night. My brother is 13 yrs older than me has always been a jerk he was horrible to me when I was growing up verbally abusive telling me I was stupid worthless you name it. He also was a horrible to my niece and nephew used to beat his ex-wife. He is a MEAN person and after much therapy and working through so much hurt HE caused I finally got the *balls* to stand up to him. I being the baby(we also had a sister she was 15 yrs older than me she died 6 yrs ago and our dad died 3 yrs ago)have always been closer to my parents my brother could care less in the seven days my mom was in the hospital he came 4 days to see her and the stayed nomore than 2 hrs. He has his own business and can close and leave anytime I took the course was there with my mom all day in the hospital and now am in charge of her pills etc and her which is fine with me. It just got to the point where emotionally and now physically I cannot deal with him. This was our second fight since my mom was in the hospital and I cannot and I mean cannot continue a relationship with him it is too painful plus there is still alot of hurt from things he did to me growing up.

Family is very important to me and though my faith in having a *loving* family should have wavered bc of my family situation it really makes me want a big family. Dh comes from a big family there are six of them and he doesn't think a big family can be loving plus his family was kind of poor and my dh is afraid that if we have anymore than 2 kids he won't be able to give them everything they want pay for their college etc etc. This is important to him as he wants our children to have everything he didn't. He said a 3rd child could be possible but the thought makes him nervous. We are adopting and we have said we want to again but sometimes I think maybe adopt two and possibly a child or two also brought into our family through birth. Dh kind of craps himself when I mention 4 and somewhat yips when 3 are mentioned. Dh has a good job with regular increases in his income. I don't know if income should determine family size?? Sure I don't want to have to struggle and I want to stay at home with them. I think I have this picture of my dh and I with a big family someday grandchildren etc etc.

I don't know if I am trying to create a large family bc of my issues with mine. I feel the need alot for a big family but now more than anything. My nephew who has a baby now said when I told him how I feel I am not wrong. Himself and his girl want several but they are young 21 I am 35 so I don't have an unlimited amount of years to have a few through birth and with adoption and the formality I might say we can afford x amount of children and the agency might say no and not let us adopt another child.

Our intentions were one bio one adopted but I have talked to people that have adopted and they said once you have adopted the pull to do it again is massive. Plus our banker told us about another couple we know casually and they couldn't become pg they adopted their first child and boom the wife ended up getting pg twice after the adoption and now they are going back to adopt making 2 adopted 2 by birth so I don't know if that is in my head.

Dh is just so afraid he won't be able to provide adequately with more than two. And I think he spoils the crap out of me and our pets so I don't know why he is so afraid?? Heck our little chihuahua has a brass bed and quite a wardrobe I just know this is weighting me down. Other people tell me two should be it bc it is hard, expensive and plain dumb to have more than two but though my head says two my heart don't agree.

Any suggestions????????????????????????????????????????????????????

[mnmarty03]

While you are 35 and your biological clock is ticking, if I were you I would just focus on getting your child from china and focus on that for a while. But that's just my opinion. You have less time, but you still have time to figure this all out with your husband. And who knows? Maybe after you have one or two you'll opinion will change. As far as your family goes, I give you a great big hug...

sorry I can't offer more advice. My fiance and I agree on how many children we want...

[Michelle]

I don't really have much advice except that with something as important and life changing as having children you BOTH should feel comfortable with your decision.

In answer to your original question, yes, money was the deciding factor in our decision not to have more children. I would have loved one more, but we just couldn't (can't) afford another.

[Mom23boys]

I don't have much advice either, but just wanted to say that I have three children and do not regret that decision. I would have had more than three, but financially we couldn't afford it. When we made the decision to not have any more children, our income wasn't what it is today. If we had the same income now as we do then, we might have decided differently. I always wanted a big family, but am now happy with my little family. I know the decision must be hard for you.

[yankeegal]

I have 3 children. About 10 years ago, I really got the baby blues. I wanted another so bad. DH didn't-felt we couldn't afford it. We went round and round about it. In the end, I realized that I didn't want another baby if DH wasn't totally on board. I don't regret that decision.

[lottaLove]

First of all, I know this must be a really tough time for you.

I think that money is playing a certain role in the size of family we would like to have. We want to be able to put all of our kids in hockey, baseball, piano lessons, ballet, or any other activity that they want to join. We want a big family, but only so long as we can afford to do this for them, because it is important to us. My MIL came from a family of 13 (she has 12 brothers and sisters :surprise: ) and I've heard stories about how there were never enough shoes to go around, or there was only one bed, so whoever went to bed first got the bed, everyone else got the floor...I would never want to put myself in this type of financial situation.

This being said, if I were to never have another child, I would still be happy, because we have a wonderful son that I love more than anything. To think that I would ever be disappointed that I only have him is absurd. It is amazing how one child changes your life, and I'm sure having multiple children changes your life just as much. Once you have brought one child into your home, you may have a better idea of what the right family size is for your situation.

I think that the financial situation is very individual. Some people may feel that they have 'failed' thier children if they cannot fully fund a college education, whereas others may feel that they have given their child everything if they provide food, clothing, and a warm bed (with lots of love). Do you want to be able to buy your kids every toy and gadget they desire? Do you want to support them through college,or pay for little league, ballet lessons and summer camp? While the most precious moments in life are priceless, all of these things cost money.

Sorry I couldn't be more helpful, just know that no matter how many children you have, you will love them to bits!!

[AmyBoz]

I have a few things to say, and it's just my opinion, so you can take it or leave it as you like.
First of all, both you and dh need to be on board the baby train if you are going to have them. One person absolutely cannot be kinda wishy-washy about it or unsure that it is the direction they want to take. The idea of "oh, he'll come around" rarely works out, and the stakes are too high, and it's not your life that you need to consider, but lives of the children.
Secondly, the idea of the huge, warm, loving family and the reality of the huge, warm, loving family are two completely different things. Will the love be there, you betcha. However, there are some real financial things to consider, no matter how frugal you are. Especially if you want to be staying home with those kids.
I agree with the previous advice...focus on the adoption for now and see how that goes. Kids are a lot of work. The most gratifying, wonderful work you'll ever do, but work, nonetheless.

[danni]

In my first marriage we had 1 boy and 1 girl, we wanted 1 more. So we did, I was 2 months pregnant when we were told it was twins. So we had 4 kids, 2 years later I was single with the kids, making $32,000 per year. 5 years later I met my current dh, he is amazing he treats all the kids like they are his own. He wanted me to be able to stay home with them(he was making $29,000 per year), so we decided to play all the bills off and then I would stay home. A few months later, I went in to get my tubes tied and found out I was pregnant. I worked up to the delivery date, went on maternity leave and never went back. We don't regret have 5 kids, and not making much money. We figured 4 kids on our income was more than enough but God had other plans. We were meant to have 5 and even though we qualify for most of the social programs, we have never needed them. Our kids might not have the $600 bikes, but they do have bikes. They aren't in ballet, basketball, gymnastics and karate, if they did all of that when would they have time to be kids. They are each allowed to chose 1 activity per year and they enjoy it. There is always lots of food and heat in our house and lots of board games to play and movies to watch. They will all have to work through college but it will help build character and they will know the value of that education better than a child who had it handed to them.

So no the money we made did not determine our family size.
We do have more children than income but...
The lessons they are learning by us not having alot of money will help them in their adult lives.

[Telephus44]

I think that income should play a role in determining the size of your family, but that it is also up to each family how many kids they can "afford" - this depends on whether or not you want each kid to have a fully funded college fund, or be able to take part in tons of activities, or whatever. Some people plan on spending a lot of money on their kids, and some don't. That is an individual choice. This said, you need to take a look at whether or not you can afford to raise a child to the standard of living that you want to raise them at.

This is kind of a tangent, but I've never wanted a large family not because I'd be afraid that we couldn't provide for them financially, but because I want to devote my time and attention to my children. I just don't think I'd have enough time or attention to spend with each individual child if we had more than three (I'm sure I'd have enough love, though!). DH and I are pretty set on waiting a year and seeing how Owen works with our family dynamic, and then probably going for number two and stopping there. Two's what we're planning on.

I also agree with everyone that says you have to be on the same page with your husband. If he doesn't think he can provide for his family, even if he can, that's just added stress in his life which is never good.

Also, just looking at your feelings - do you want a large family because you think your children will be happier with more siblings? Or do you just have an image that large families are happier because they all love and support each other? Not saying that there are any right or wrong answers, just something to ponder since you're obviously searching yourself to find out why you want a large family. And I think that our own families play a huge part in deciding how many kids we want - I don't get along with my sister, so for years I only wanted one child so that they wouldn't fight with their siblings.

[SammeyG]

Well I had a daughter from a previous relstionship 11 years ago. I have always wanted a big family. Both of my parents are 1 of 3 kids. My dad has an older brother and a twin. My mom has an older half sister and a full blooded sister. But I only have a younger brother. Him and I aren't as close as we were when we were younger. But like I said I have always wanted a big family. When I met my dh 7 1/2 years ago he never wanted any child. He is the youngest of three. But there is a 16 year age differance between us. When I frist met him he did tell me that he too also had a daughter from a previous realtionship. That he had never had any contact with her. Well that changed a few years ago when she came looking for him. Then this year another girl from his past is claming that her son is his son as well. Just because this boy has blond hair and blue eyes like my dh. This year he has just came to terms of thinking about having children. So I don't think it matter what your income is. Just as long that you have a home.

[Backtoreality]

Both myself and DH came from large familys. I'm the oldest of 5 and my DH is number 10 out of 11!!! We decided a long time ago that if we waited til we could afford kids, then we would never have any. So instead God taught us what He thought was a good size family. We each had one daughter from a previous marriage, within 10 months of wedding day - along comes DS. A year later DD#3. Then to top it off, during our fourth year of marriage we adopted DH's nephew who was 11 at the time. (SIL was shot by her ex-hubby) So when I tell people we were married 4 years with 5 children - you should see the looks!!!LOL
I guess when it comes to the size of families, I get very defensive when others start that "can only afford" thing - Where would some children be if everyone thought that way!! Yes we had a choice whether or not to keep the doors open.
You always find a way to afford what the kids NEED, not always what they WANT. But when they grow to adults they do realize the difference. Another thing they did not lack was the LOVE from us and each other, even to this day my kids are close as adults.
In closing, it is VERY individualize on how many children you have, but please don't let money be the only deciding matter. Let it be only a small part of the decision.

[TheRootedNomad]

yes our finances have played a role in our family size to date. My sons are 10 and 7 and up until a year or two ago our finances were really tight. However, for me it wasn't that we wouldn't be able to provide for more children but the stress it would put us under. Knowing how tense we are under pressure made me think it would be better for the kids to have us less stressed. DH voiced multiple times that he didn't feel we could afford more. This coupled with medical reasons led me to agree to have a tubal at the same time I had my second son. As my heart has always wanted more children....for me and for them to have each other (I always worry that if something happens to one of them there isn't another sibling for them) sometimes I wish I had not agreed. I would not have made that decision based on finances alone though. If there was a young relative that needed a home, a medical fluke resulting in pregnancy, or some other cause for a new child in our life they would not be turned away because of finances, we simply haven't actively sought out a larger family due to finances. These are our choices though and I think as a couple everyone's choices should be what works for them.

[marei]

Hi:- I agree with everyone that stated both parents have to be 100% on board when it comes to adding to the family. It really doesn't matter how they reached the decision - it takes two yesses, not one yes and one no, or one yes and one maybe - two definite yesses.

[Sari]

I come from a large family, and I hope to have one for myself - I'd love to have 4 or 5, maybe 6 kids, by birth and/or adoption. Personally, I'd rather do without some luxuries and be able to have a big family, than have my family size severely limited and have more disposable income. I hope that makes sense.

[mom2three]

I agree with the lady who has her children in one activity per year. Time with family is much more important than activities and such provided there is love and the basic necessities of life (healthy food and shelter).

The thought to give kids what you did not have is a good one. I understand as there was not much money when I was a child either. However, many parents today are not teaching their kids what the difference is between needs and wants. People tend to give their kids everything instead of teaching priorities and work ethic. I work at a university where many of the young people have an entitlement attitude because they have been given so much. Parents hover around and do not really let their children learn the consequences of their actions. There is little respect for others and much whining and self-centered attitudes. Because they have been given so much, the students do not want to put in the effort to work for grades or to even refrain from littering (someone else will pick it up!)

I guess what I am trying to say is that I understand your husband's logic, but feel if there is enough money to provide the necessities, income should not dictate number of children. I generally do not believe one should be on assistance though and be having more children. I do, however, agree that you need to be united in the decision and either of you may change your mind after children - they are certainly life changing!

To give you a bit of background - we did not have much money and I started working for income (picking strawberries ~5-6 hrs per day) when I was six years old (I will not do this to my kids). I grew up paying for any extras that I wanted (always had food, shelter, and secondhand clothes) but was expected to do lots of housework). I graduated first in my class from high school, went to university on scholarship and jobs (one $2500 student loan, $102 from Mom and Dad), now have my Ph. D, am on mat leave from a full time job, have 3 girks (age 6, 2, and 2 mos), and am realizing that my children want time with me rather than the extra money my job brings in. We have cut back on a lot of wants. My kids are healthier (less stressed), happier, and the atmosphere of my home is much better. We will help with some college/university (dd 6 has ~7000 in an RESP and we are just about to start a small RESP for dd #2), but expect our children to contribute as well to teach responsibility.

BTW, I have found there is no convenient time to have children - many times we think they aren't affordable or will disrupt life too much.

Sorry for the rant!