Question for adoptive parents...
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  1. #1
    Registered User Cricket1's Avatar
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    Default Question for adoptive parents...

    Okay, just reading the whole Duggar thread is mind boggling--it's been highjacked every which way possible. lol. One poster made a comment about adoption being wonderful and that their are so many "unloved" children in the world. Just wondering how those of you with adopted children feel about that statement. To me, choosing to place a baby for adoption is a loving and unselfish option. I really believe that placing a child for adoption in an act of love because you want something better for that child than you (as a birth parent) may be able to provide.

    Thoughts?

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    Registered User Dancing Lotus's Avatar
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    I have not adopted but can I jump in?


    I think that statement has two sides.
    1. Yes , sadly there are a lot of kids that were given up out of purely selfish reasons.
    2. Your right in most cases it was done out of love. I think its selfish to keep a child that you know you can't/won't care for. I would like to think that this is the majority. Sadly I know a few people who won't give up their kids when in reality it is the best thing for the kids.

    But all in all I do think that most kids who are given up it was done with the child's best interest at heart.

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    Registered User Jamauk's Avatar
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    Hi Cricket,
    As you know, I'm not technically an adoptive parent yet (we're trying our darndest to fix that though!) But I agree with you - putting your child up for adoption has to be one of the most selfless things any parent can do. Granted, in the States there are the occasional kids that are taken away from neglectful parents, but that's rare. In international countries, I don't think Big Brother is there to take the kids away. Its the parents giving them up because they are hoping for a better life for them.

    I tried to convey that a little bit last night (I'll admit, I was one of the ones hijacking the thread!), when I mentioned that adoption isn't about pitying a child - that seems a little condescending to me. We are not going to China because we want to save a little girl from life in an orphanage. We are going to China because we want to expand our family and at the same time we know there are children in China (or Vietnam, Korea, Africa, India, Russia, etc...) that need a family.

    It needs to be about family, not pity. Even now I know my daughter's mother has made (or has yet to make) a horrible, grueling decision - my heart breaks for her, but I'll be eternally grateful to her at the same time.

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    Registered User Lady_V's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cricket1 View Post
    ... adoption being wonderful and that their are so many "unloved" children in the world. Just wondering how those of you with adopted children feel about that statement. To me, choosing to place a baby for adoption is a loving and unselfish option. I really believe that placing a child for adoption in an act of love because you want something better for that child than you (as a birth parent) may be able to provide.

    Thoughts?
    I was hurt by it. To think DD was an 'unloved child' really upset me. The reasons a child is placed on adoption varies with each. A child could be born to a family too young, financially unable, culturally unable, death of one/both parents... the list can go on and on. On the other hand, there are children who are better off being adopted because the parents can't emotionally care for the child.

    I appreciate the pro-adoption stand people take, but sometimes I wish they would become more 'aware' of the things they say, and how they say it.

    "Adoptive parents" -- I honestly HATE that word, but it's the least offensive word to me that I can use for people to understand I did not give birth... I am DD's MOM... I am DD's HEART MOM... the woman who gave birth to her is her Tummy Mummy. DD did not grow under my heart... but IN it.

    "Real parents" -- I hate this word more... real parents are NOT the ones who donated chromosomes... real parents are the ones who are there for you. We are REAL parents. We are the one who helps them develop in to the person they are meant to be.

    Heart Parents are not saviors... we did not save anyone... we are not heroes... if anything, the KIDS are OUR heroes...

    Sadly there are many children waiting to be part of a family...

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    Registered User Nishu's Avatar
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    I saw an ad on craigslist one time asking for donations because the posters sister had taken in an 'unwanted' baby and was having trouble wrangling up all the necessities. I publicly replied that there's absolutely no reason for anyone to take in an 'unwanted' child, because if that's the way you see it you should probably pass along the opportunity to someone who would see that baby as a blessing. Of course it was promptly flagged and removed. Everything I post there is.

    I was pretty much of the opinion that *I* wanted that baby, and that a million other parents would have taken her in and felt thankful for the opportunity. Anyone who sees themselves as a hero for adopting a child should probably just adopt a puppy instead.

    That's not very well put, is it? You get my point.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cricket1 View Post
    Okay, just reading the whole Duggar thread is mind boggling--it's been highjacked every which way possible. lol. One poster made a comment about adoption being wonderful and that their are so many "unloved" children in the world. Just wondering how those of you with adopted children feel about that statement. To me, choosing to place a baby for adoption is a loving and unselfish option. I really believe that placing a child for adoption in an act of love because you want something better for that child than you (as a birth parent) may be able to provide.

    Thoughts?
    That was me and I think you're grossly mistaking what I meant and taking two separate things that I was saying and squashing it together. I was talking about all kids in general, we have an obligation to help all the kids of the world, not just ours. I didn't mean to imply that all kids up for adoption are unloved. What i said is that there are children in this world who are unloved by society and need help. These include children with abusive parents, children who live in war and hunger. All these children need help. All these children need love. And we all need to take care of each other. All I wanted to know is why the Duggars don't do that.

    My whole point was that too many people close themselves off to helping others, helping children. Adoption is just one facet of that.

    However since we're on this now, I will suggest that perhaps your view of adoption is somewhat rose colored. Not every one is conceived, born and raised in love.

    I do think making the choice to place a child up for adoption because you realize you don't have the resources to raise your child is beautiful, that is an act of love.

    Unfortunately it does NOT mirror the marjority.

    I have at least a dozen friends who have been adopted. NONE of them have the lovely sacharrine story of a mother's sacrifice loving her child so much she made the hard decision to give that child up. Yes, I know these stories exist all over.

    One of my friends has siblings who were born addicted to crack and extracted from neglectful mothers. One friend has been through the foster care system after being beaten half to death by her drunken father. Two friends, sisters, found their real parents after their so called father sexually abused them as toddlers, and their mother thought pouring bioling water on them was good discipline. One friend has come from a place that she's lucky she wasn't just outright executed at, or before birth. There are orphanages around the world stuffed full of disabled children who will be ignored and forced to live their entire lives in one room. There are older kids across this country who don't get parents because they aren't pretty little babies given up out of love. I myself had custody of my younger brother because my parents didn't care to be parents.

    I know what it's like to be a child who is trashed, used, abused and uncared for. WE EXIST. I had parents. I needed help from other adults that I didn't get. I needed new parents. I needed people to care about me -- and now that I am an adult you better damn site believe I'm going to do my best to BE one of those adults who care.

    I was not in the least implying that all adopted children were "rescued" or never felt the love from the mother they came from who makes that good choice. If you can't tell children's advocacy is a major trigger and passion for me, ANYONE who puts their children above their own selves I hold high in respect. But that is definitely NOT the case for the bulk of children in need. There really are kids who are thrown away in this world.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lady_V View Post
    [FONT=Century Gothic][SIZE=3][COLOR=Purple]I was hurt by it. To think DD was an 'unloved child' really upset me...(snip)
    "Adoptive parents" -- I honestly HATE that word, but it's the least offensive word to me that I can use for people to understand I did not give birth...(snip) "Real parents" -- I hate this word more... real parents are NOT the ones who donated chromosomes... real parents are the ones who are there for you. We are REAL parents. We are the one who helps them develop in to the person they are meant to be...
    Lady V I hope my clarification of my stance and meaning of "unloved children" (I know I'm the one that kept repeating that) um, unoffended you?

    I posted my soapbox before I read this, and I refered in there someone as my friend's finding their real parents. The people who parent are the parents, period. I hate the term modifying the word parent. A parent is a parent is a parent.

    Just as a general statement as to my business in this thread, too, I'm not sure if I made it clear but I *was/am* an "adoptive (ugh) parent." Although neither one of us consider me "mom", I legally had my brother, through the roughest years, and he considers me a parent, and that's what I did, parent him. Just because he's my brother, too, doesn't make it different.

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    Registered User Jamauk's Avatar
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    Janie,
    I realize that you meant no ill will with your choice of words and I really do know where you are coming from. Unfortunately there are a gazillion people in this world that aren't educated about adoption and some of these phrases give those people the wrong ideas - and these wrong ideas can sometimes cause emotional grievances for our children....

    I hope you know that I wasn't attacking you or felt any ill feelings toward you at all....

    just sayin'

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jamauk View Post
    Janie,
    I realize that you meant no ill will with your choice of words and I really do know where you are coming from. Unfortunately there are a gazillion people in this world that aren't educated about adoption and some of these phrases give those people the wrong ideas - and these wrong ideas can sometimes cause emotional grievances for our children....

    I hope you know that I wasn't attacking you or felt any ill feelings toward you at all....

    just sayin'
    Oh no no I didn't feel you were attacking me at all. I apologize to all on this thread actually, I realize I'm probably being oversensitive (going through a rough time right now, kid related things are buggin' me something awful, i was just getting ready to post on it actually) kind of frustrated feeling that I wasn't communicating my feelings properly and wasn't being clear enough to begin with.

    I just wanted to make sure everyone understood I didn't mean for "unloved" to be a blanket term for adoptees and I do have very high respect for mothers who come to adoption as the right choice for their children.

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    Registered User TheRootedNomad's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=Jamauk;897641]Hi Cricket,
    Granted, in the States there are the occasional kids that are taken away from neglectful parents, but that's rare.

    QUOTE]

    Please take this with this as the differing information that it is. I am not trying to be argumentative. I have simply been dealing with a side of the fence for my entire adult life that most people never REALLY see.


    I try to stay out of the adoption discussions because I am ignorant of a lot of the circumstances/conditions/information on private adoptions, international adoptions, and so on. I am NOT however, ignorant on the "occassional" kids taken away. There are at a minimum, hundreds of thousands of them available for adoption at any any given time because of the atrocites committed to them and sometimes, sadly, to how thier survival instincts and have to respond to those atrocities. There is even a special title for a large portion of these children because it is so incredibly hard to find someone to be thier "forever family". Most of them qualify as SNAP children (Special Needs Adoption Program) because they are - any race other than white, are over 10, are a sibling group of 3 or more, or have a mental handicap. There might be a few more things that qualify as well. The large majority of these children age out of the system. In the 18 yeard I have worked in the field I have worked with THOUSANDS of children personally that are "unloved by any family" and the heartbreaking part is that many of them won't ever have a family like that, only one that was cruel and destructive. Janie's examples are far from farfetched...in the world of children where parental rights have actually been terminated they are small cruelties.

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    Registered User Laurie in Bradenton's Avatar
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    Okay, now its time to hear from one of those "occasional taken away kids". My DH's whole family was taken away from his parnets at age nine. Seven children were removed from the home in June of 1965. The house was so terrible that it made the front page of the Va. Pilot for 2 days. The children ranged in ages from 10 to 6 monthes. They were broken down into smallgroups and shipped off to seperate care facilities. Never to see each other all again. The 3 oldest went to the Va. Boys Home then the younger 2 were placed into foster care. The youngest 2 were adopted right away and remined of it everyday for the rest of their teen lives. The third youngest was adopted and has never been seen or heard from again, we've tried! The next two found that safe spot, 2 adults who loved and cared for them as their own.
    My DH was the second to the oldest and went from foster home to foster home for 3 years. He was beaten, starved and abused and loved. He finally ended up being taken away from the loved home because they wanted to adpot and placed at a church/school/home in the mountains of Va. The placed is called Mt. Mission School. Not a perfect place but a good place. He got a good education, good care and some love. A group setting doesn't allow for much love. But MMS did right by him and he owes them alot as do hundreds of other kids who have pasted throught their doors since 1921.
    We have reunited with most of the brothers and sisters. Also with the birth parents. The kids have all made their semi peace with what happen to them.
    Most of the kids have had messed up lives. As adults they are trying to help others along the rocky path to recovery or just to adult hood. We work with dozens of kids in our area from being a Safe Place to getting those who are coming out of foster homes on their feet.
    We applaud eveyone who tries to help weather by fostering, adpoting or listening. Anyone can criticize the system working with it and with those init taks a special type of human being.

    Laurie in Bradenton

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    Registered User Jamauk's Avatar
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    Ok - let me clarify when I said "occasionally taken away" - the reason I said occasionally was not to infer that there were only a few children being beaten/neglected/sexually abused, etc...

    I used that tern because I have seen over and over and over and over again those that were taken away be put right back into their biological household. When I first started college, I wanted a degree in social work - I quickly realized I didn't have the stomach for it. To those of you that work in the industry - KUDOS to you and I'm grateful everyday that you do what you do.

    I have friends that are foster parents. They get these children that have had their bodies and minds abused over and over again. However, most of these kids won't let their spirit be broken. The kids are amazingly resilient. And 9 times out of 10 once some headway is made and the kids are finally starting to feel "normal" (for lack of a better term, please don't beat me for that word) again - they are swept out of this house and put back home for a "trial period". Our system here is geared toward keeping "families" together by almost all means possible. Don't get me wrong, I know our system does a lot of wonderful things for a lot of children and not all cases end up this way - but it happens often enough for me to believe our system may be broken just a little bit.

    I really really really wanted to try a domestic adoption (foster to adopt), however DH knew that he couldn't handle it. He knows his limits and if the child was taken away (either by the state or by the birth mother changing her mind) he knew that would stretch him way beyond what he was capable of handling. I respect that - in all honesty, I don't know if I could handle it either...that is why we chose international adoption.

    I didn't mean to offend anyone by my choice of words. There are many reasons that children are available for adoption. And I'll fully admit - I've only lived in this "world" (of adoption) for about 18 months. I've tried to do as much research as I can and I'll continue to research and read anything I can get my hands on for the rest of my life. Each case of adoption is as different as each child waiting for their families.

    My apologies if anyone was offended.

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    Registered User Cricket1's Avatar
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    I absolutely agree that I was viewing this just on my experience. Based on what I read, both of my sons' birthmothers agonized over their decisions to place the babies for adoption. And although I guess I do view this with "rose colored glasses", I do recognize there is a huge dose of grief that plays into adoption, as well.

    Yes--there are many chlidren that are taken away due to abuse and neglect. I did not consider those when I made the statement that adoption is an act of love on the birthmother's part. As many of you pointed out, there are sometimes really crappy parents that don't consider much more than themselves. I missed this whole part in my consideration. Sorry.

    From now on, I will make sure that I note that I'm ONLY considering MY OWN experience with adoption.

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    I just want to say that the issue of a child being "unloved" doesn't mean that a child is unlovable, only that those around him/her aren't capable of love.

    DH and I are trying to adopt through the foster care system which has broken our heart time after time, I won't even get into it. However, reading threads like this make me more persistent than ever to bring a child into my family. Thanks for the reminder on mothers day.

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    Registered User IntlMom's Avatar
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    Default Ok, you know I have to chime in here!

    I know, you are all wondering when I was going to jump in right??! lol
    I'm not really going to address the whole "unloved" thing. Although I will say that ds10 was taken to the ophanage and eleft at apporx 2 days of age and left there by "said" birth mother. ds9 was born to an alcoholic that left the hospital 2 hours after he was born. And dd2 was left abandoned at the orphange gate in China IN DECEMBER with no note, no nothin! Were my children "unloved' by birth parents? I don;t know, I never really will.....but it does not really matter, because they are the apple of my eye!

    OK, the thing that ppl say to me that makes me the most ticked off is this:
    (and it is always said by kind, well meaning ppl who really have no idea that they are stepping out of line saying what they are saying!)

    "It was really great of you to do what you did. You are a really great person for saving these children. I really respect/admire you for what you did."

    I know, that sounds nice and all, but it makes me sound like I did something special. I am my childrens mommy, not their saviour. You don;t tell someone with a newborn that you respect them for giving birth do you? I don;t want to be seen (or have my children) be seen any different......

    (now, truth be told we DID save our children from a horrible life that I don;t even want to try and envision.......but I just want to be seen as their Mommy!)

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