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10-23-2006, 01:29 PM #1
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Dh is just clearly not on board with me here:(
I've shown him the numbers. I've discussed our dreams. I've shown him how we can set goals to achieve those dreams. He still wants instant gratification Yesterday he did some painting and brought home $100 and I told him that I wanted to be clear with him that the money we were sticking in the lock box was an EF and he looked at me like a grew a second head. He joking said no it's his fun money and I almost lost it. I know only a part of him was serious, but it's that part that will take that money and blow it. He just doesn't care enough about all of this and it worries me. I asked him to read the Dave Ramsey books with me and he just blows me off. Last night I printed out the form about EF's and savings with all of the categories for him to browse today. He took a quick look at it this morning and threw it back on the counter and left for work. I know he's afraid that he will never have any fun again or ever just be able to buy something he wants and if he would just give me ten minutes of his time, I can show him that's not the case. What he doesn't realize is that I've been sacrificing my wants for years to compensate for his. He won't keep track of what he spends unless I hound him about it and I do. I just don't feel that our relationship should be this way. I'm mad that he won't take a proactive approach with me. The other day he was discussing getting $20 gifts for everyone for xmas. I politely told him I had gifts planned that would be worth much more than that in the end and that it wasn't going to cost us nearly that much and we could do everyone for about the price of one or two people in his line of thinking.
He doesn't understand that he's not rich. He doesn't have anything to show anymore and I'm not really clear who he's showing anyway. I've been quite forthright with my new friends. I'm a frugal person and I don't do a lot of activities that require money because I'm putting my money to better use. The best thing I can give my children is myself. They'll never remember going to the bouncy place once a week or eating out or shopping at the mall. They'll remember that mom was there to do everything else. Most of my new friends get that. I just wonder why my husband doesn't. I am truly afraid that he is going to force us directly into another financial mess and I don't want to be a part of it.
I'm going to sit him down tonight and lay it out for him one more time. If he needs "blow" money to stick to the plan then I will find a way to do that for him. He just needs to understand that we are tightening the belt even more because now, there is nothing to fall back on. If we don't and can't make it on the cash we have, there are no other options. This is it. I think I have a great budget in the works and I've been tracking our spending and seeing where some leaks are and what percentages certain things seem to be. Our pets alone cost an average of $100 a month between vet costs, meds, food, litter, etc.... I don't know how to cut that back. I already order everything I can at a discount. We did switch them to a better food which was more expensive, but they eat less and there's less waste so I think that's a wash. It should, in theory, last longer. I've realized that dd's school nickel and dimes us to death. Every other week they need a check for one thing or another. I know she was upset that we didn't buy school pictures, but they were such a ripoff. Now they're selling yearbooks for $26. Wow! This is elementary school. Her last school sold yearbooks for $10. I could stomach that. I hate to tell her no, but I don't think I can justify that much for a book she'll look at once every six months or even longer. Who knows.
Sorry to rant. I'm just really fed up with my dh and it's not just the finances. When one thing is stressed, so is everything else and I might as well be a single parent. He's not home even when he is home. All he does is yell at the kids for every little thing. I'm just trying to let the anger go. There's no place for it here and it won't solve anything
10-23-2006, 01:43 PM #2
Feel free to vent anytime - that's what we're here for! I wish I had a magic wand, or even some good advice for you, but I don't. Hang in there, and take care of yourself! Your family needs you right now. I hope that your DH gets on board soon.
And giving him some "blow money" sounds like a good idea. We ended up giving ourselves a monthly allowance that we could spend on whatever to curb a lot of the nagging (you spent how much on shoes/coffee/computer games/etc?). Because DH was used to spending a lot more than I am, the allowance we settled on is a lot larger than I wanted it to be ($500/month), but it did keep him from going out and blowing money on stuff that wasn't in the budget. With me about to be unemployed, we're going to try cutting it back to $300/month.
10-23-2006, 01:46 PM #3
Have you considered counseling, either as a couple or by yourself?
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10-23-2006, 02:38 PM #4
- Rep Power
Has your dh ever sat down and paid the bills himself? Maybe he doesn't realize just how much money it takes to run your home every month.
10-23-2006, 02:52 PM #5
- Rep Power
I'm with Sarah on this one, I think blow money is vital. Without it my dh would have balked a long time ago. Ours is set pretty high, $75 each every two weeks, but it's what keeps us happy and on budget.
Sorry you are having these problems, wish I had a sure-fire way to get him on board advice, I don't. But will send (((hugs))) you way and hope you two can work it out very soon.
10-23-2006, 02:55 PM #6
You both sound so stressed! I have a feeling that he feels like he's working his rear end off (which apparently he is), so he feels entitled to spend some of the money he's making. There is some validity to that. I think you should let him have about $25 of that $100 he made from painting to spend however he wants. Save the rest. Hopefully that will satisfy him a little.
Have you shown him the numbers you've been crunching? Does he ever see the bills? If he hasn't, he needs to. If he has, and he's still insisting on blowing any money that comes in, then he's in denial. Although, I'm wondering if he took the painting job specifically so he could have some spending money. If that's the case, then he really needs to be allowed to keep some of it for that purpose. However, he also needs to realize that his family has needs, too. He can't spend away just on himself.
10-23-2006, 04:27 PM #7
first of all.... HUG to you..
Sorry that your DH is not on the same page as you are.
I was in a similar situation too. But I will post my thread separately, since I have some questions on my story.
but HUGS to you...hopefully you two can work.
10-23-2006, 04:52 PM #8
that's exactly what I was hoping to not hear. I am sorry Kimberly. I know one thing though. You say Dh isn't there even when he is home. Something is amiss. I was listening to Dave Ramsey this morning, we are on delay, and there was a man on the phone with similar concerns. Dave Ramsey told him he needed to get counseling and that he (DR) was going to pay for it himself, because he didn't want the marriage to end over this issue. I think the most striking thing DR said to him was that they may just need a mediator to help each other be heard.
Either way, I know the one thing that I have heard DR say over and over is that you have to love the other spouse into taking necessary steps to getting out of debt.
I pray you and Dh can get this worked out.
10-23-2006, 06:52 PM #9
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Thanks for the input. The money is only a quarter of the money from the job. He's not finished yet. With him it's all or nothing if you kwim. We've taken turns over the years paying the bills and I've done it now for the past year and a half or so. When he did it he would pay extra to everything until there was no money leftover for groceries, gas, misc., etc... Several months ago we were down to the point where I really couldn't even spare $20 for blow money and that was the roughest time in our relationship I think. He said he felt like less of a man because he always had to turn down his coworkers who wanted to go out to eat or he had to ask me for money for every little thing. So even though we didn't have it, I did what I could to find it. I just want to get out little EF to $500 and lock it away. Of course I want to keep building on it though It's just like he thinks that because he's made so many sacrifices he's entitled to just blow through a ton of money. He took on this painting job so we would have more money to get ahead....now he wants it for himself. I know there's a compromise here. Maybe giving him a certain amount every month is the only way I can do it. He's supposed to get paid $900 in December for the two night classes he's been teaching and I know he thinks that money is "fun" money. I would love for that money to be "fun" money, but we would be so much further ahead to pay off some things and put money in savings. He's only on a ten month pay plan and we're going to lose a good chunk of income come June and I want to put enough money away to pay our bills for those two months. Then, come August when he'll start getting paid again, our budget will have to go down by $600 a month or so since he'll be on the twelve month plan instead. I want to get a solid plan in place to live within that budget and the sooner we start living on less the better. If we can start living in anticipation of that pay drop, we could save probably an extra $500 a month. Honestly though that's pretty far fetched right now with all of our expenses, but I anticipate a decrease. A good example is the utilities. I figured our average including the phone is $400 a month, but we're coming into winter down here so it should be significantly less and that extra money needs to be saved. If he sees it he'll think it's extra money to spend. I don't know what to do or think here. All of my attempts to make him frugal have backfired on me and now he feels deprived. I know he'll do some work over the summer, but I don't know what. Right now he thinks maybe he'll paint. He's on his second job down here and he already has two more lined up so I think he has a promising possibility there. Maybe I do need to lighten up some. I am just so scared right now and he's one of those types that holds everything in. I think he feels like he's failed as a provider and that's completely not the case. I know losing the house is going to really impact him, but in the long run, it's the best thing that can happen. Neither of us are cut out to be landlords and the lady living there has walked all over us. I couldn't help but feel badly for her when her dh ended up in the ICU the day after their wedding. I kept thinking about all of the bad things we've gone through and what could I do? Demand she pick up a second job and abandon him there so she could pay us the rest of the rent? I mean I did what I could, but I just wanted God to bless them and in a way, our situation will bless them for a little while. Anyway, I digress and ramble.
Thanks again for the input. I'm going to spend some time meditating and doing my favorite thing, number crunching, and see what I can do.
10-23-2006, 07:40 PM #10
I hope all works out for you and your family. You have been thru so much already it seems like it is so stressful for you.
I think dh needs to grow up and understand he is not single and he has a family (you and kids) and he needs to support them. So what if he can't go out with friends suck it up and get over it. He doesn't know the way those people live they could be worse off then he is. I am sorry but this just burns me he is not entilted to anything at all except for providing for his family. If and I mean if there is some money left over then maybe he can have some money.
My dh and I have been here and still are here we are learning day by day. It is rough but tough luck. You did not make this money mess on your own you should not be the only one to suffer he needs to realize that your marriage is a partnership and he is part of the problem and could be a big help in the solution.
I think he is a little on the shelfish side of things and needs to realize that he has thinks that needs to be taken care of and needs to do that first and then and only then if there is a little money left after putting some back for a raining day so to speak then he can have some money.
I am sorry if anyone thinks this is harsh but he needs to grow up and take care of his family and bills and not think of himself. I am sorry if I offended anyone because that was not my intent but I think he needs to step up and take part in fixing this mess that you are in together.
10-23-2006, 07:59 PM #11
I was biting my tounge when I wrote my initial response, but I was thinking the same thing. You can't afford your child's school pictures, but your husband thinks he should be able to snap his fingers and you can make money appear? It's like you have to be his mother, wife, and personal banker. That's unfair to you and the rest of your family.
I know that we can only "see" so much in an online forum, but the behaviors you describe sound selfish and immature. If you keep cleaning up his messes he has no incentive to change...and you will continue to suffer all of the consequences.
10-23-2006, 11:30 PM #12
It's clear that Dh needs to step up to the plate here and be a little less selfish. OTOH, you mentioned all attempts to make him frugal have failed.
We can lead a horse to water, but we can't make it drink the water. kwim?
I would say that if you can find a way to compromise on the blow money, then do it. Sounds like he needs other people's approval. Then, does he have knowledge of where every penny is? Or, can you stash some away without his knowledge? I guess that would be my approach at this point. At least that way you know you will have something in case of emergency. If he blows all of his money, that's it. I hate to say this, but you may have to hide the EF from him.
10-24-2006, 10:21 AM #13
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Well, we had a little heart to heart last night and I broached him about the money in the lockbox. He said that he wanted to pay off his grandmother. I asked why he didn't just say that before. Also, I pointed out that we had made arrangements to pay her in full when he gets his retro pay. The last thing she would want us to do is give her this money I'm trying to save for an emergency. So the issue on this money is not exactly clear. What is clear after our discussion though is what will happen with his paychecks. I told him I'm going all Dave Ramsey on him and every penny will have a home. I offered the blow money and he said that he would be content with less. I disagree with him so I'm still going to allot the amount I picked to begin with. That way if he does "need" that much then it's already accounted for. He said that he wants his painting jobs to be money he can put away to save for bigger things. Fine. We don't "need" that money to do everything I want to do with our budget. It's irregular income so it's not included to begin with. I could certainly get us ahead a lot further if he would give me that money, but I sense that I shouldn't push the issue right now. I explained how I thought the lockbox would be too tempting to just grab money whenever for whatever and he said he was keeping it all in hundred dollar bills. That could be both good and bad imo. Bad that in if you only needed say a twenty, you took a hundred and the chances of putting back eighty are slim. Good that if you need twenty, it's the last place you're going to look for it. It's really frustrating. I told him it's sink or swim and I don't plan on sinking which is why I've imersed myself in learning how to do this the right way.
We discussed what I thought was a fair amount for groceries and he wanted me to bump it up by a hundred because of all of those little things we see that we forgot to put on the list. I can see that what I really need to work on with him is the difference between a want and a need. If we have a thoroughly mapped out budget, then we need to map out everything else as well including our menu. If we always have a menu in place, nothing will be missing from the list. I can see adding the extra hundred if we include pet supplies and toiletries perhaps.
In any case, although I'm not one hundred percent pleased with the outcome, I think we made some progress last night. I know he's tired of thinking about money, but it's all I ever think about. I need to have things planned. My first goal was to get $500 in a mini EF and I think he'll come aboard for that.
Yes, I agree my dh has some growing up to do. Absolutely. He's a total clown. This one area of our lives stresses out all of the other areas and we need to compromise with each other, but not compromise the goals we're heading for.
I know I've made some progress with him. He's wanted a big screen tv forever and I've always said no. Plain and simple that's a want that we don't need. He said that he really wants to save up for one (geesh on top of the second car fund, EF, housing fund, medical fund, etc...) and that he doesn't even need a brand new one. He said he would be happy getting a refurbished model from the tv repair place or a discontinued model, etc... That's how I know he's growing. The old James never would have settled for anything used or not top of the line. There may be hope for him yet.
I know I can't make him change, but I can be the positive example. For the first time in my life I feel like I'm finally going to have a handle on the finances and when it's payday there will be no stress because there will be enough to take care of the things that need to be taken care of.
10-24-2006, 10:21 AM #14
I have to agree with the last three posts. May sound harsh, but this is really affecting you and I don't understand how your DH can see you so stressed out and not want to help alleviate this stress. That is what marriage is. Not one person takes it all on all of the financial responsibility/stress and the other worries what his co-workers will think of him if he can't go out to eat. Being a man means taking care of the most important people in his life-you and your children. Period.
I hope you can work this out.
10-24-2006, 12:17 PM #15
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Well, I've been there. James has got to get it through his thick head that toys and fun money come absolutely last when you have debt! Nobody gets to play with money until all the bills are paid. No it's not fun. A lot of life ain't fun. Staying up all night with a sick kid ain't fun either but it has to be done sometimes right?
Time for James to pull up his big-boy panties and just get on with it. Good luck with him, I don't envy you one little bit. If push comes to shove, remember he is not the only man on the planet. There are lots of men in this world and some of them have a helluva lot more common sense than the one you have now. (not trying to hurt your feelings, just telling the truth)
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